PDA

View Full Version : Check out what I found on Ebay



spookhaven
04-28-2010, 07:35 PM
I emailed this company and asked them if they owed the copyright and they said absolutely. It's mighty close to PaleNights door.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200449948623&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWNX%3AIT

Front Yard Fright
04-28-2010, 07:46 PM
Yeah "Hirez" and Kip have been duking it out for a while now on some other forums.

I feel for Kip and hope he can get some justice.

freak 'n' stein
04-28-2010, 08:43 PM
yeah, this has been a HOT topic over at the halloweenforum

...it sucks for people who work hard creating such GREAT and INNOVATIVE stuff for the industry.

Dreamreaper
04-28-2010, 09:52 PM
Hmmmmm, who has proof of it first?

Dr Spooktakular
04-28-2010, 10:38 PM
This guy has had these up for a while, a long while. All I have to say is this, some people go to the shows and see all the stuff. Some people will buy it because they don't want to take the time to learn how to make it, others are so creatively and technically inclined they can reproduce something to the detail and do it for pennies on the dollar. Kinda like people who make blood for the haunt, but refuse to tell you how to give it the shiny look and blow you off when you ask, what they didn't know is that I was prepared to buy 10 gallons of blood, and this happened with 3 different vendors at TW, none of them got my money, nor will they. There's always someone who will show you the tricks.

Darkangel
04-29-2010, 07:23 AM
Could you post the link to the halloween forum?

Thanks,
DA

freak 'n' stein
04-29-2010, 08:09 AM
...Kinda like people who make blood for the haunt, but refuse to tell you how to give it the shiny look and blow you off when you ask, what they didn't know is that I was prepared to buy 10 gallons of blood, and this happened with 3 different vendors at TW, none of them got my money, nor will they. There's always someone who will show you the tricks...

While yes, there is always "someone" who will show you the secrets, that "someone" is usually pretty hard to come by. I can't say I blame the vendors for not sharing their recipe for blood. It is a pretty hard commodity to replicate with just the right look. If you didn't come to them and verbally say you were going to buy 10 gallons in exchange for their knowledge then how did they know you weren't gonna go and rip them off? Even if you were legitimately going to buy 50 gallons, who is to say you won't go and sell the same product afterward? Don't be mad at vendors for protecting what they put in the effort to achieve.

...on the OTHERHAND, if it is something that the vendor themselves cannot or do not produce, ie. hardcoating material for foam, why not share your SOURCES?!! just food for thought

xtremecreator
04-29-2010, 08:20 AM
This is sounding kinda familar...........A CopyRight is the best money you will ever spend.

John

Dr Spooktakular
04-29-2010, 09:57 AM
Let me clarify myself, I buy blood regularly, I'm not trying to copy or reproduce it. My questions were, once I have the blood, what technique do I use to make it shiny once it dries. Usually, once the blood dries, another product or method is used to make it look shiny. I hope this clarifies my previous post.

Terrorknight
04-29-2010, 12:01 PM
I just want to know who killed Mrs. Peacock with a Lead Pipe in the Conservatory? Why won't someone just tell me?

kpolley
04-29-2010, 01:12 PM
Hey guys, I won't say much about this situation as my lawyers are dealing with it now and have asked that I don't speak on the matter myself anymore. I will say that I appreciate the support of everyone out there who does support me. To quickly touch on a couple of the questions / issues brought up here:

1. We created this concept more than a year ago and absoultely have documented proof of that. Everyone else that has tried to copy our work, and there have been many, were at least 8 months behind our work so there is no question as to who originated to concept.

2. As for blood recipes and whatnot...you should buy OUR blood. The secret to making it look shiney...it just dries that way!!! Nothing else to do. Are you ready to buy 10 gallons now? ;)

3. If you really want to wade through an almost 50 page forum thread, the link is:

http://www.halloweenforum.com/halloween-props/77181-asylum-door-prop.html

Much of what happened of note has been edited or removed but you can definitely get the main idea which is that a bunch of home haunters tried to replicate my work and then one of them decided to try and profit from it. Pretty cut and dry but very drawn out. Again, I don't really want to get into it right now at my lawyer's request...but when this is all done I'll post you ALL the details and all of your collective minds will be blown.

Till then, thanks again for the support here and from those of you (FrontYard and others) who have been supportive on the other forum too. We appreciate it.

graystone
04-29-2010, 02:47 PM
I have heard people say this before "Oh I can make that or oh I can build that" Always hated to hear people say that. For one if you could have why the hell have you not did it already? why do you need to copy someone's work? Second why not support the guys that come up with this if they were not doing it then we all would still be standing around scratching our head and holding our balls! Shane and its point blank! SUPPORT THESE GUYS WHO CAME UP WITH IT! Shane this time!

shawnc
04-29-2010, 06:24 PM
I don't think copyright comes into play here (other than the wording of what the character says). A patent seems the more likely choice. A lawyer would be the one who knows for sure, but I do know that these things get really tricky and costly.

It is a really cool prop. They'll probably be importing them from China this Halloween. China could care less about your patent, trademark or copyright.

spookhaven
04-29-2010, 07:48 PM
Here is my take and I didn't realize it was a topic on another forum. Just like in my day job, you do something great with advertising and everyone copies it. No different in this business. Kip (who I do not know personally) has come up with a cool idea but it's last year's creation. It is changed but certainly very similiar. Plagiarism is the best form of flattery, so I have been told. It's not easy when someone copies your idea and makes money from it but atleast Kip knows who produced the concept first and brought it to the show floor.

Unfortunately some of us smaller haunts with not nearly the budget as some have to work with have no other option but see an idea and try to come up with something similiar. Sometimes, as much as we would like to "just purchase it" we can't. Therefore it sometimes is copied to a point.

I wish you luck in your argument. Didn't mean to hit a sore spot, just thought I found something by accident and interesting.

Jim Warfield
04-29-2010, 08:07 PM
Why waste any of it knowingly copying somebody else's STUFF!?
I have never understood this.
Maybe it's just "Me"?
I have tried from "Day-One" here to do my own ideas, concepts as much as humanly possible.
And guess what? People come here to see all of the unusual and "something -news" that I have made!
The one biggest complaint customers always tell me is that other haunts are all too predictable and too much the same!
Do all of you drive brown 4-door Chevys with no chrome ?
Why not?

lurker
04-29-2010, 11:27 PM
That video and the way that person is marketing it is definitely a rip off of the Asylum Door. The idea was bound to be copied, but if you are going to copy the idea at least take 15 minutes to sit down and come up with a unique spin. The combination of animation and video has infinite possibilities. Why copy exactly what has already been done?

Shane, I think you alone make up the revenue vendors lose to small haunts and home haunters that say "Oh I can make that or oh I can build that". You must have dropped at least a half a million with them based on your goodies list. The bitch change they lose to do-it-yourself-ers doesn't compare to what large haunts spend. The do-it-yourself-ers isn't even an issue. The issue here is profiting off someone else creative property which is wrong.

spookhaven
04-30-2010, 02:07 AM
Lurker:

You are 100% correct. That was my point of the whole post.

Gore Galore
04-30-2010, 07:21 AM
Definitely sad,
But you know what. Kip, you have every right to be upset about it. But you know what else. You will forget about it, and then you will add another twist to the idea the next time around because of this, which will make your products that much more unique.
This company only does the video. You does so much more, and add so much more value for the dollar that way.
So, in a weird way you should be thankful for the competition. It just makes some of us better.
The competition does, not the theft. Karma will play its part, and this guy or company will operate based on that.

Tons of Costume vendors entered into the market this year, and if you think we are not upping the bar on what we do for next year you are nuts. Expect to see us pull out all the stops for next year, and you can expect Kip to do the same thing.

Matt Marich
04-30-2010, 08:00 AM
This industry is ready for a shake-up on this issue. Edge Designs has also had issues with it, and we are protecting ourselves from this in the furure. One garage haunter making a knock off is one thing, selling someone's **intillectual property on E-Bay is another.
Vendors rack their brains trying to make cool new stuff for Haunters, and we have so many great buyers, people that really support us!

Matt
Edge Designs

**I'm sure i mis-spelled that word, I'm not an intillectual like Kip.

xtremecreator
04-30-2010, 09:47 AM
Hey Larry,

Im waiting for you to stick up for this bad guy to. Lets hear it.

John

SomeThingInTheIce
04-30-2010, 10:30 AM
Build it yourself, no! Think about it once you add up all the materials and lets not forget the gas and running around to get all the stuff needed. Then you need to set down and do it, how much is your time worth to you. Then once you have it bulit you will need to work out all the bugs, why will there be bugs you ask? Because you have never buit this before and the vendor that did has. Add it up, on something like this you are better off getting it from a vendor, who will stand behind his or her product. There are a lot of things that you can build yourself for your haunt but on something like this get from a vendor. I mean would you want to build your own barrel wall or would like someone like Pale Night Productions who knows what the he// there doing do it.

Jim Warfield
04-30-2010, 10:18 PM
Like today.
I totally gutted one room recently and today was "put back" day.
Hook up the trailer, drive to the Ravens Grin Warehouse, load up some stuff, drive back, carry it all up a long flight of stairs, but not everything, no use getting stuff put in my way prematurely.
The numerous tool boxes and locations and other collections of nuts, bolts, washers, screws to hunt through AND I still had to drive to a hardware store to find what I needed!
This particulair room is operable now, the cracks are plastered over, not painted yet..but then the way it is right now looks ominous to me. Sort of barren like a jail cell or a torture room or some other bad-vibe sort of situation going on in there....maybe "Less" is "More"?
Maybe it feels like this to me because there is no artwork or silly stuff in the room?
The room seems so empty because , it is. Maybe as everyone screams the open, empty space will echo those screams?
This might be something new and abit different?
Did I forget to mention this? This has always been the most terrifying room in the house and the proof is on maybe 500 video tapes all filmed in this room, and what I have been mentioning here has no relation to my matrimonial history either!!
Darn it!

spookhaven
05-01-2010, 07:01 AM
Well since I started this, I found another one on ebay from Scarefactory's walker people. It's one of those things that every vendor has to deal with. If I recall, the Vortex was an issue years ago.

Think about it, it's no different than going on the haunt tours seeing something and taking it back to your haunt, put your own spin on it and creating something "similiar". We are all "making money or should I say collecting money (LOL)" from it.

It happens in every industry. Kevin said it best, it makes you rise above the rest, that's why Extreme, Gore, Pale, etc are all still around to talk about it and bring us great products. The others won't make it because they were the after thought. They can't come up with these products themselves so they will die out because they aren't the creative minds. What comes around, goes around.

shawnc
05-01-2010, 12:11 PM
Well since I started this, I found another one on ebay from Scarefactory's walker people.

I think the walker copies were on ebay within a week of their Transworld debut. The copies probably shipped out sooner than the originals that were ordered.

Jim Warfield
05-02-2010, 01:05 AM
I built it24 years ago, maybe i was "first"?
But I only built one, no "production".
It's still on display in my house.
and SFW?

Cookie Crumbler
05-04-2010, 01:23 AM
Kip,

I feel for you man.

This guy trying to make money off of your hard work should be ashamed.

I'd understand if he changed it up a bit, or even made his own door for his own use. But he's just directly stealing your idea, and even selling people detailed instructions on how to NOT pay you for your designs. That is so damn weak... and really frustrating. It's pretty sick actually.

I saw on that other forum... You showed up to defend yourself and they had the nerve to rip you apart?!? Who do those people think they are? They have no respect for the people who are actually out there innovating- while they sit at home copying. Is this the "me" generation or what? That's YOUR PROP they are copying and they don't even show you respect. Unbelievable.

I'd advise anyone here with an ounce of integrity not to buy from this hi-rez guy.

Regardless, keep up the fine work Kip, and good luck with this.