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The Wilmont Estate
10-02-2012, 05:53 PM
Hey guys

If I wanted to theme my haunt around an artists music and then use there name on the advertising to I have to get their permission? I'm not planning on using their music.

Allen H
10-02-2012, 06:28 PM
If you are going to theme your haunt around their music, they why wouldn't you use their music? I would move on from that theme choice. You need their permission to use their name, stage name or given name it makes no difference. You would need permission.
I would move towards 100% originality as opposed to basing it off of something else be it music, a movie, or and other form of media that is not public domain.

BigT
10-02-2012, 07:00 PM
Allen is right. Not only would you have to have their permission, but most major acts (such as Alice Cooper) demand royalties and licensing rights to use their name, images, song titles, or anything else affiliated with them. Our campground was forced to pay ASCAP memberships because they wanted to have a Margaritaville party. They weren't using any of Buffett's music, just having a party based on the theme. They now pay dues to ASCAP, BMI, and SECAP to cover them anytime they play music.

If you use music (outside from Midnight Syndicate or any of the other Haunt Industry groups who cover licensing in other ways) you ahve to pay ASCAP and BMI at a minimum for the rebroadcast of music to your audience. Makes no difference how the music is used (the same is true of all bars and restaurants who all pay these dues). And I can tell you from experience that these guys are extremely aggressive and will pursue you even if you are a small business.

The same goes for movies and TV shows. These all demand licensing rights to use any theme or video segments from their media.

The Wilmont Estate
10-02-2012, 07:11 PM
Alright I gotcha. Its not in our budget to get the rights to music, movies or television shows. I guess I could take "inspiration," from the songs and incorporate those ideas into my haunt, thus creating an original concept while taking ideas and concepts from other sources. This has been done thousands of times in props and haunts across the country so I should be able to get away with it. I have emailed ASCAP about using one song in our line, but am almost confident the cost I'm going to get back from them is going to be crazy.

I recall reading something that was saying that you only have to pay rights on music if it was people are paying to hear. For example if I used "The Carny" by Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds in one of my rooms I could get away with it because I'm not directly making money from that music. I don't know if this is correct or not but remember reading it somewhere. No one yell at me!

BrotherMysterio
10-02-2012, 10:06 PM
I recall reading something that was saying that you only have to pay rights on music if it was people are paying to hear. For example if I used "The Carny" by Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds in one of my rooms I could get away with it because I'm not directly making money from that music. I don't know if this is correct or not but remember reading it somewhere. No one yell at me!

But you are making money from it directly, no matter how indirect it may seem. Granted, you aren't working within the modality of public performance or exhibition of the music, but if that music, or key elements and motifs of it which are covered by copyright law, is directly woven into the fabric of the haunt experience that you have created, and that the public is indeed paying for it, then you are directly profiting from that music. The public is paying to ultimately experience it, one way or another. Just not in the context of a concert venue.

To look at it another way, imagine if you were doing a Darth Vader room. Basically, you'd have a totally dark room, with whatever little ambient light revealing some kind of sci-fi set. As the guests enter, they hear that trademark mechanical breathing sound. Then, in the darkest corner of the set, the red blade of a Sith light saber ignites and lunges towards the guests, taking a near miss swipe at them (ref: duel from Empire Strikes Back). Out from the darkness steps Lord Vader, all 7' of him, saying "I have you now, young Jedi!" or whathaveyou. You might even be tempted to have the "Imperial March" on cue, as a part of the soundtrack, triggered when Vader attacks.

Now, technically, you aren't showing any of the Stars Wars films for paid public exhibition, you aren't selling tickets to it, or popcorn for that matter. You might even consider, to presumably get around the copyright infringement of using the "Imperial March", instead using "Mars, the Bringer of War" from Gustav Holst's "The Planets", which purportedly was the temp track that Lucas used to write those Imperial March sequences, before John Williams scored the films and composed the original music for it.

You could do all that, however, nonetheless, merely using the image of Darth Vader, let alone the embodiment of Darth Vader as a character in your haunt (no less in a room clearly based on and modeled after his character), would be considered a major no-no. Basically, Lucas would have a conniption fit and his lawyers would have a field day. (Good luck with that! Nice knowin' ya . . . LOL!)

Rule of Thumb: if you'll be using it, you'll be paying for it.

Incidentally, who was the artist in question? Was it indeed Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds, with his song "The Carny", or was that merely a "for instance"?

C.

The Wilmont Estate
10-02-2012, 10:33 PM
I don't want to reveal the artist at this time because this may still happen. But the song "The Carny," has a great opening that I wanted to loop in my queue line.

Cliff
10-03-2012, 08:50 AM
If you go forward with it, in one of the TW classes this year we were talking about using popular artiest and the subject of coast came up. It was surprisingly cheap!!!! i forgot how to do it but someone on here will know.

BrotherMysterio
10-03-2012, 11:31 AM
I don't want to reveal the artist at this time because this may still happen. But the song "The Carny," has a great opening that I wanted to loop in my queue line.

Well, cool tune, but you could always take the bit you wanted to use and have someone rewrite it for you a bit. Going back to the Darth Vader example, the Imperial March was basically Holst's "Mars, the Bringer of War" until John Williams wrote the original-to-star-wars version we all know.

Compare:

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Incidentally, a number of bits of "The Carny" sound like already available circus haunt music that you could either use for free, or for the cost of the CD. You might look into that.

C.

Naked Ghost Productions
10-03-2012, 02:23 PM
Check out Nightmare-music.com (http://www.nightmare-music.com). Just released a carnival album. Licensing is free with registration.

The Wilmont Estate
10-03-2012, 05:39 PM
We aren't doing a Circus theme but will definitely listen to those tracks. Thanks guys! Gonna get cooking on 2013 soon.