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graystone
03-11-2013, 06:19 AM
Was it just me or did the show seem a repeate of the last year or two with less excitement? I can't put my finger on it and maybe it's just me but it seemed quiet kinda? I mean it's hard to say. I remember last few years there was lines you had to get into to buy product and this year there was no wait. I talked with several vendors and they said well we have sold some stuff. My thoughts was this past Halloween was not as good for Haunters as it has been or could have been. I figured the down season would be passed on at the show and I feel my thoughts was right. I don't know maybe someone seen something I did not maybe I am getting a little burned out who knows but I would love to hear what others thought, felt and seen? Shane and it's please comment!

Deathwing
03-11-2013, 06:25 AM
I can't speak for vendors and sales but it seemed slower and less exciting overall. Saturday was very busy, maybe too much, but as for sales I'm not sure. Not very many things that people "had to have".

Jake

graystone
03-11-2013, 07:34 AM
Yeah I was in the Darkzone talking to a vendor friend on Saturday and this is a popular vendor but no one was hardly coming up! I wan't to see the vendors blow it out of the water in sales just seemd quiet Saturday more for sure but still quiet over all! Hopefully they all did well and it was just me. Shane and it's good to be home!

austind
03-11-2013, 07:56 AM
I would agree, now I don't buy till the last day unless it is a staple things like fog juice and stuff like that. I placed a big order with GG on Sunday and it took me less than 15 min to negociate a price and give you my money, so I would say that it was alot quicker. (or I did not bargan enough) I would say that it may be the lacked of that big bang item that causes a buzz around the show floor. It was a flat season for haunts and that may have caused a flat TW, I dont know but I did notice that I did not hear anybody saying did you see this at such and such at this booth. The thing is that people expect so much now in wow factor and this year did not have that. GG has gotten to the point that you guys make such unbelivable stuff that even with a incredible costume like the Panzer you start to expect those things from you. ( I bought Panzer and 3 others by the way) I was telling a person about a woman that I go to haunts with and that this one person walks out of every haunt and when you ask her what scared her the most it is almost always the same cheepest simple scare, fishing line hung from above. Where there is just about no prop that GG makes that I would not like to own, there is still something to be said about staying with what proven and works. From what I heard it was a combo of attendance at haunts being down 10% to 30% which is right of the top of profits and the lack of that must buy item. I will say this for this TW that I did not spend as much as last year and almost half of what I did spent was with GG, great job guys.

Phatman

P.S. Did my stuff ship yet. LOL

austind
03-11-2013, 07:58 AM
sorry shane I though GG started thread. All I can claim is jet lag.

Phatman

Deathwing
03-11-2013, 08:15 AM
You mentioned GG sure they have great stuff but did you not find their booth much like it was last year? I'm not knocking GG in any way and they are one of the best but the booth looked and felt as it has before and thought they had great new actor animations and costumes, they were basically new versions of the same things we've seen. It is unfortunate but you could say that a great company like GG could be taken for granted as a staple of quality items but you know what they offer so some may look for what's new and different and look elsewhere first? Just a thought.

Jake

austind
03-11-2013, 08:16 AM
Shane I will add this, I did hold back a little to wait and see Unit 70 at their open house and MHC and I did hear a lot of people talking about that. I dont know if that could have been a factor or not but I do know of 10 people that said they dont go to MHC every year and they were going just to see Unit 70. I personally feel that is was a lack of funds due to the down year at haunts myself. But I have the feeling that MHC will have a big atendance boost this year due to the fact that Unit 70 does not go to conventions any more.

Phatman

Deathwing
03-11-2013, 08:26 AM
From what I hear unit 70 has a list of certain haunts and they are enough to keep them busy and that's just how they like it. It's much easier cranking out large orders for 12 Haunters than 100 small orders for 50 haunts. They don't need the show to be successful.

Jake

austind
03-11-2013, 08:32 AM
Deathwing I do agree that it was about the same and most of the items were just a new twist on past products, but that was the whole show this year. The whole show lack the OMG I have to buy that at any cost item. I think that things go in cycles and this was just one of those years where the vendors did not come up with that show stopping product. Look at Nightscreems he brought mostly vacform and stuck with what he does best and did not bring their other stuff, when haunts have bad years so do vendors. The only thing that I wanted to buy that wowed me was the Little Orbit Donut machine to set up in my office, I would never leave to go home then.

Phatman

Deathwing
03-11-2013, 08:37 AM
Deathwing I do agree that it was about the same and most of the items were just a new twist on past products, but that was the whole show this year. The whole show lack the OMG I have to buy that at any cost item. I think that things go in cycles and this was just one of those years where the vendors did not come up with that show stopping product. Look at Nightscreems he brought mostly vacform and stuck with what he does best and did not bring their other stuff, when haunts have bad years so do vendors. The only thing that I wanted to buy that wowed me was the Little Orbit Donut machine to set up in my office, I would never leave to go home then.

Phatman

Lol yes those donuts were great there were two guys selling them. Well said as well about the show.

Jake

wickedfarmer
03-11-2013, 11:03 AM
Had to look for that item to grab you this year. Last year as soon as you walked in the door Gore Galore's stuff LITERALLY jumped out at you. This year it was still great Gore Galore stuff with newer of same idea....or peak under the skirt to see new "better built way". Even my "wow" of year you could not see by walking the aisle; you had to go inside the vortex to experience the new tilting bridge.

Bought stuff that wowed me last year.

Wicked Farmer

Jolly Pumpkin
03-11-2013, 11:19 AM
I arrived on Friday and commented on how dead it was. It was extremely easy finding a parking spot this year compared to previous years. There weren't many innovative products this year and not much really stood out. Scarefactory didn't have much that would make my jaw drop and it was just the same old stuff from everyone else it seemed. I was really impressed with Immortal Masks compared to the other silicone masks there. Halloween Productions had some great CGI props that I think were just as good as Pale Night Productions if not better. I think there was a time period where the haunt industry was getting bigger and bigger with new products that would rival Hollywood. The haunt industry grew too fast and it's hard to be innovative when you've reached your full potential. It was a good show, but not a great one.

austind
03-11-2013, 11:21 AM
Farmer you know you country boys live a simpler life than us city folk but I was wowed by the girl in the latex body paint booth but she was not for sale. So I will have to stick with the donut machine. I did like the zombie doors from Scarefactory and the price seems good but worried about the build quality and durability of it. I will have to put a post up after haunts shut down for the next season to see it anybody bought it and how it worked for them. You did tell me at the show that you have some SF products and have never had a problem so I am still on the fence as far as buying one. The bridge was a nice twist for the vortex tunnel and I did like the new line from Poison Props.

Phatman

wickedfarmer
03-11-2013, 11:27 AM
[QUOTE=Jolly Pumpkin;147715] It was extremely easy finding a parking spot this year compared to previous years.

Got up early to move from hotel Sunday "to get a good parking spot" for taking home my Poison & Distrotions props I bought. HA!!!!! parking on west side of show floor was a breeze! Went to lunch and drove to Pappy's Smokehouse. Returned to show at 2:00pm as show was ending and got my same great parking spot back. Sure glad I got up early on a night we set clocks ahead LOL!

austind
03-11-2013, 11:38 AM
Did they have ribs? And why did you not bring any back for me?

Phatman

wickedfarmer
03-11-2013, 01:14 PM
Unlike Wed. night we did not have to see them add ribs to the SOLD OUT board just before we ordered. Had ribs, pulled pork and brisket. I think Pappy's was my real "wow" of the show. Went there 3 times. Yeah, twice without you. Went back just before I headed home Thursday afternoon on my first St. Louis run.

Wicked Farmer

drfrightner
03-11-2013, 02:23 PM
I thought this years show was 100 times better than last year from the standpoint of variety. We saw the same transformation with IAAPA from large vendors to small vendors who have unique items. We saw a lot of mask companies...that is a great thing. We saw a lot of detailed booths... awesome. We saw several costume companies ... couldn't be happier! We also saw some food vendors for the first time so I would say finally we are moving closer to IAAPA. Plus we had several retail type companies, zip lines, inflatables and more. I loved it!

The things that left me feeling totally underwhelmed...

1) Interactive Haunt: If you ask me it was one of the worst things at the show! i was looking at it going what is the point to this??? It totally made no sense and wasn't even 1/10th as detailed as the 90% of the booths and the products where not well placed, showcased or whatever. It was just pointless. I'm not in any way trying to take away from all the people who worked hard to set it up I guess my overall feelings are we don't need this product. There should be a replacement concept like a haunter build off, building sets live, maybe a big showcase in the middle of the show floor where vendors can buy demo time or something rather than on wings of the show... do something right in the middle something truly interactive because the interactive haunt was anything but...

2) Animations: Totally not the year for animations and they bring a lot of excitement to the show in the past... maybe we've run out of ideas here. Maybe its time for something new and different I think animations should be limited and those same vendors should focus on props, or other concepts.

But overall I think the show offered more bang this year because of the little stuff while at the same time might leave you with the impression it wasn't exciting. I get it.

Larry

Darksidestew
03-11-2013, 02:56 PM
Its a BUYERS / VENDORS SHOW...So far, from what I hear....not good

If no one buys or sells .......its a failure. My 2 cents.

Stew

wickedfarmer
03-11-2013, 02:56 PM
But overall I think the show offered more bang this year because of the little stuff while at the same time might leave you with the impression it wasn't exciting. I get it.

Larry[/QUOTE]



BINGO Larry! And as far if no one buys or sells (Stew)... I bought my normal amount. Threw some at newer vendors who had little things I liked. Big animations years ago helped put me on the map...like Slayer on the Pediment of Scarefactory. It got the news cameras (doubt it would today in my area). Paid more attention last few years to enhancing actors with things that go POW, cast of sparks while clanging knives together, or made loud nosie. Got the whole spectrum now from great eye candy to surprising props and actor enhancers. But the excitement of seeing new stuff, like that of Christmas morning after Santa came of many years ago....just wasn't there for me this year.

Wicked farmer

BigT
03-11-2013, 03:16 PM
I've been doing trade shows for decades in another industry. When you do a show every year, pretty soon it starts looking like last year, with maybe a few new items being showed off. We didnt go to TW this year for two reasons;

1. Ticket sales for us were not great, and I want to use the money that I would have spent traveling to TW on new stuff for the haunt.
2. Even last year I started seeing a lot I saw the previous year, and I think every other year is probably a good thing (unless we are just so flush with cash we need a road trip)

I am hoping to see the stuff vendors brought to the show via the web and their sites, and I will be making purchases that way, but my purchases this year will be very selective, and the vendors even more so (after going through some bad experiences last year).

With all that said, someone post some pictures would ya!!

Motograter
03-11-2013, 03:26 PM
I have to agree with you Larry, I thought the interactive haunted house was terrible. Last year's house was 10x better! I did have a lot of fun! We ended up buying a couple things to add to our attraction this year.

Motograter
03-11-2013, 03:33 PM
I want to add something, I thought the $1,000 minimum purchase from "some" vendors is stupid. They lost our business because of that. Just saying

Darksidestew
03-11-2013, 03:47 PM
I think the reason this years TW looks like last year, and all the other years is because when a vendor comes out with a great product 4 or 5 other vendors try copying it, and display it the following year.....

Masks - Everyone sees CFX and others getting 2000 for thier masks, thats why I believe there are all these mask vendors this year.


Animatronics, Everyone wants the next level........ and the technology is out there, BUT who is going to pay 50,000 for 1 creature.

NOT THIS INDUSTRY...
If you want better you must pay for it......
stew

john haines
03-11-2013, 03:49 PM
this show is DOOMED !!!!!! no one has any money and these guys are making you spend at least a grand. gimmie a break. Thank you for hurting ALL OF US !!!!!

john haines
03-11-2013, 03:51 PM
both those show ROCK !!!!!!! and everyone who is ANYONE is there.

Darkangel
03-11-2013, 04:11 PM
both those show ROCK !!!!!!! and everyone who is ANYONE is there.

John you are way off NO ONE goes to either show! Houston was beyond dead and national looks more like a craft store or church bazaar than a real convention. A few big guys go but it's probably 95% enthusiast and small time of home Haunter. Most Haunters are building then.

DA

graystone
03-11-2013, 05:05 PM
I bought one of the doughnut machines! Shane and it's one of the few things I did buy. But I have so much I need to start using what I have. Shane and it's maybe its my age now!

austind
03-11-2013, 05:33 PM
Dammit Shane I hope it wasn't the last one, did you get the little orbits? I loved it i would have bought one but i am fat enough, I did hear more talk about that than most props. I think this year was a show for the guy at the average haunt not the guy looking to spend $50,000 to $100,000. There was more stuff for the average Joe that only had a few thousand and wanted to make impactful purchase for his haunt. By up grading your props for your actors you can really stretch dollar, and who knows you have better attendance next year and you can go buy the big stuff then. It's not like it won't still be there next year when you hopefully can afford them.

DA I have to agree with you about national.

Phatman

Allen H
03-11-2013, 05:48 PM
I was pretty happy with the show. I think Gore Galore and Poison props knocked it out of the park. Stiltbeast studios did pretty well and sold out of masks by saturday 90% being gone on Thursday. I mostly hung in my booth the whole time and we had a steady flow.
Im going to agree with DarkAngel in saying that National Haunters convention is tiny. It is like a Haunt craft fair as opposed to a show. Im not saying dont go, but saying it is a better show to buy things for your haunt is silly. Houston also has very little for haunts, great for a halloween store but not good for haunts.
Allen H

SCfearfarm
03-11-2013, 08:05 PM
We decided not to go this year for the first time in a while because of exactly the reasons already mentioned......we were 30% down on ticket sales which means 30% down on money, and the first thing to get the budget cut is props.....you cant cut your marketing, you cant cut your staff, and you cant cut your insurance, utilities, etc. so the only thing to cut is props.....and if I don't have the money to buy things, there is no point in making the trip up just to look. I know of a few haunts in my area that stayed at home as well for the same reasons.

drfrightner
03-11-2013, 09:59 PM
Couple more things... I'll admit if the show wasn't here I wouldn't go every year either but I will say clearly TW is the best show out there bar none. I don't even know why we bring up these other shows they are not even close to being in the same category. All these shows can claim whatever they want but they are NOT EVEN IN THE SAME LEAGUE! TW however seems to be moving more and more into the fun category more like MHC and I think that is a mistake honestly. MHC is the tour and the haunt party show, while TW should stick strictly to being the show for professionals no matter who actually attends.

On another note ... TW should keep the focus on having the best speakers, best topics, best events for professionals all the other stuff leave to other shows.

Two the interactive haunt has gotten so bad it should be eliminated.

I don't think at all that the show was bad, but I will say this like I've said in the past...SOME VENDORS NEED TO STOP thinking they know what buyers want. Vendors should take road trips in October and see as many haunts as they can and talk to as many haunters as they can read these forums, ask for help, ask for idea's, hire focus groups, whatever and maybe TW can help here. This would help keep the industry going in the right directions.

Four... I have NO IDEA what vendor had a 1000 order who did that? This I need to know!!!

So please spill the beans on that one!

Larry

Capt.Chaos
03-11-2013, 10:07 PM
For me , I really enjoyed the show! As a 4th year guy it offered numerous things for me.

I brought some of my key staff so they could see "The big picture". That will pay off on Nov.1st with my staff seeing my vision and understanding what we are striving to achieve. I am empowering them to fill their responsibilities and I believe they are "getting it" by the advice and pointers all of you shared with them. Thanks much!

I understand what everyone means by nothing that totally blew you away. But look at all he things the vendors have brought to the industry in the last few years. CGI fx, animatronic puppets, silicone masks, and the list goes on. I would say that the vendors have a tough time "Wowing" us after the last couple years. On the flip side, I see progress in the industry with customer service and more variety. Someone mentioned smaller items. Yeah! A lot off them. It was great. For me I am now no longer a "haunt rookie". So I am able to look at everything and still keep my head on straight. I can totally appreciate all the work, talent, and creativity in all products without losing sight of what will work or not in my show.

My sales were way down last year. Whose fault was it? Mine. I come to this show to enjoy all the creativity of the industry. I treat my show like a business. And part of my business is this show. I focused HARD on what is going to increase revenue to my haunt. One item I bought was Decimated Designs muscle suit. I think I bought that thing within the first hour of the show on Thursday. What for? Well, I will put an actor in it but....I will drop money out of my traditional advertising budget to pay for that thing. Now we will put a ripped up straight jacket on that thing with "Property of Fear Asylum " on it and put it on the parade , fair route in about a month. Killing two birds one stone thing. It is interesting and will fulfill 2 roles. That thing will turn heads.

I was disappointed with the interactive haunt also compared to last year. I don't honk they should get rid of it but last year was way better. I know a bunch of people worked hard on it but, not near the caliber that this show can produce. I think a scene build on the floor going on all week would be great. Watch it come alive.

What did I buy?
1. 2nd haunt. 2000-3000sqft 3D haunt from Stuartizm Design. This will increase ticket value but I am going to put it in a different location then my main haunt so I will have 2 locations promoting my business.
2. Computer show controls. This was a huge purchase that was not even in my radar this year. But, my show lacked in the FX market last year and this system will make my show a heart stopper for the next numerous years. This may not be for everyone but, it was a smart investment as far as I was concerned.
3. Guppy Pod marketing . I almost bought the PIC marketing last year. I believe this is easier, better value, and will increase my revenue within the next few years.
4. I could not pass up on the animatronic mannequins. Creepy as hell. Couldn't pass on those.
5. European body airbrush setup.
6. Stilt east studios masks, Halloween Productions "iron mask", a few others.
7. Etc. lots of random stuff. Oh yeah...that LED geyser fx from froggys fog. Love it! Thanks Tater!

Loved the show! had a blast! Really enjoyed making more haunt friends and catching up with some old ones.
BUT... I'm pissed. I never tried the donuts. I thought you had to buy them. Oh we'll. see ya next year.

Buck

drfrightner
03-11-2013, 10:34 PM
Okay since the direction changed so I'll post my thoughts on what was cool...

Coolest thing I saw... nothing not one thing! There just wasn't a coolest thing there. What did I buy?

Scarefactory: Two of those inflatables because I'm going to put one on my roof and at my other haunt out near the highway. Those should drive more business.

I bought a couple masks from the show floor because I got a great price and other than that NOTHING!

The company I thought had the most stuff I would buy if I was buying anything... GHOST RIDE they had a lot of cool gory stuff.

I would love to have that giant plant monsters from Gore Galore but it was pricy. I liked the mannequins clearly that was inspired by Silent Hill 2 but it was cool just didn't know what I'd do with them. I thought those guys had very affordable prices. I like Dark Ravens stuff however it seemed like mostly the same stuff as before maybe just bigger.

So overall I bought nothing really... I did however make a huge order with Unit 70 again for Creepyworld. I still didn't see companies just come with nothing but props monsters, standing figures so I just keep going back to Unit 70. I'd like to see the animation companies just stop for a year or two and making monsters, and props.

Overall I was most interested in the small stuff.

I talked to many vendors who said they didn't do well... but I'm with all the haunt owners in that I had a bad year as well. But let me say this to ALL THE VENDORS... ALL HAUNTERS will break loose with the money come June or July TRUST ME because they can't help themselves.

Just keep the faith because the biggest buying season is June on anyway and this year it might be the biggest one yet... so fear not!

Larry

Tater
03-11-2013, 10:44 PM
Okay since the direction changed so I'll post my thoughts on what was cool...

Coolest thing I saw... nothing not one thing! There just wasn't a coolest thing there.
Larry



Larry, Should I remind you that your company was there VENDING...and you didnt see one cool thing at Transworld....Interesting!

Buck, anytime buddy, As I told you I loved it so much I bought one too and I dont own a haunt hahaha

drfrightner
03-11-2013, 11:42 PM
Hey I think it goes without saying that every vendor who brings product there thinks what they brought is awesome otherwise they wouldn't bring it... so yeah I liked what we brought but I'm not going to say it was better than anyone else so I don't say anything about it. That is up to the buyers to decide. I am going on the record here to say we had a great show we sold a lot of stuff so I'm not going to complain there. We are happy and thank everyone.

I didn't like anything there the best... I liked a lot of different things but just nothing stood out as WOW!

Larry

MDKing
03-12-2013, 05:28 AM
Tater,

I missed your booth this year can you send me info on the LED geyser lights? allan@bennettscurse.com.
Thanks,
Allan

MDKing
03-12-2013, 05:50 AM
Transworld has definitely changed from an all business show to now being a show packed with activities and nighttime events. While most are there for business there are those now coming to party and hang out much like you'd see at MHC where business isn't always the main focus for attending. I think Transworld above all else should always focus on business and the pro Haunter first, and the other shows are great options for home Haunters, enthusiasts, actors, and people looking to hang out and party etc.

I enjoyed the show this year though. I did notice that many vendors booth looked the exact same and with the same products as before. I was also surprised that Scarefactory had the inflatable this year. It looked cool but that seems like something that would've been done 10 years ago at the height of the inflatables boom but they did a nice job with painting it. All in all the vendors and Transworld did a great job.

Allan

mindtumor
03-12-2013, 06:11 AM
Four... I have NO IDEA what vendor had a 1000 order who did that? This I need to know!!!

So please spill the beans on that one!

Larry

Reimagine your booth in your mind and then look to the right towards the entrance of the show.

$1000 minimum order wouldn't be bad if you had $1000 worth of new interesting stuff and not all the same stuff you have been selling for years.

Kudos to Gore Galore, nice stuff. I like the smaller props, keep it up.

Scarefactory had a nice hallway of doom that clocked me in the head pretty good, really nice if I wanted to actually kill people that came through my haunt, thanks for the headache.

Larry, I will admit your air blaster/ water blaster stuff was pretty vicious. Just stop blowing people off and start answering their questions, lol.

graystone
03-12-2013, 06:31 AM
I love our vendors some really, really great guys and I hope they made a ton. I feel bad when I don't buy but again I got stuff I am not using now! I just felt maybe everyone was a little bummed from this past season? Just like I say just felt someting missing before, durning and after hours of the show. I think I missed alot of folks too. Oh and Larry you left that g string and wig in my room I left it at the front desk to pick up! Shane and it's oh and I lost my damn checkbook too!!!!

austind
03-12-2013, 06:53 AM
I will say this the parties are after hours and those who came to party I don't think got out to the show floor much. I know I got a lot of stuff handled in the bar and lobby area, this was the only place where you could get a one on one with a vendor and not have people hovering waiting for their turn. I will say that I wait till Sunday to buy because I don't do much cash and carry, and I found that the vendors gave me better deals this year. I was getting 10% to 15% of show prices from guys, I don't know if that was because the sales were slow or that they knew there are not much sales to be had on Sunday. Larry were your sales per hour better early or did you do good on Sunday? I like Sunday because the show floor is slower and I give my self the chance to think over what I really want to buy. I make a dream list and work back from there Friday and Sat. I am a impulse buyer so I need help and time to keep me from buying donut machine. Like I really needed that thing hanging around.

Phatman

Slain
03-12-2013, 08:12 AM
Vendors.. Meet some great new ones and chumbed up with some old ones.. Bought hardly nothing.. Half of last years order dollars wise .. Im with Larry that Unit 70 will get some $$$$ from us...
I think the show is really very slow and lame.. No offense to anyone but it is a very boring show. I walked the floor a couple of times per day and except for a few vendors I saw very few folks buying the goods.. lots of folks buying up the floor samples on Sunday.. That is real neat to be able to do if you can haul it..
I do have some advice for all those that sale cash and carry at the show including Jen at Transworld..
The IRS will be knocking on your door/booth one of these days.. St. Louis will figure it out and go back X number of years and burn each and and every vendor doing such.. Mark my word it will happen I've seen it first hand. You talk about headaches.. I dont think Transworld or the vendors are prepared for that kind of real TERROR....

Michael Inks
03-12-2013, 09:10 AM
We admittedly came in with a lower buy budget this year so it was a little less exciting for us. However, we unexpectedly loved VFX Creative Studios Attack Zombies. Loved those things, finally decided to drop some unplanned quid on one only to discover they were sold out of the year. Congrats to them though, apparently THEY were even surprised! Sometimes the most simple innovative props are the most exciting and coveted.

I would like to mention something though that kind of honks us (and I hope it isn't 'off topic') Seminars. A hefty portion of the reason we come to TW is to hear from the heavyweights in the biz and glean some real insider knowledge and techniques. Not to be that negative guy but for the last two years, we are about 50/50 on the seminars being either GREAT, or a complete waste of time and money. Again, we're not negative people, but after a couple of the seminars we were privately wondering if we could get out money back. But we're nice fellows so we kept our traps shut. I just wonder if a better job couldn't be done vetting the speakers to ensure that they have a solid outline and are also effective communicators. Even the most talented of folks can turn a seminar into a real snoozefest (not to mention money-drainer) if they aren't able to effectively communicate their expertise.

I'm just sayin. The ones that were great, were fantastic and we couldn't write fast enough to keep up. But a couple... yikes...

wickedfarmer
03-12-2013, 09:16 AM
Don't want vendors to read too much into the "no wow" this year as "their stuff sucked and don't want it". My business model involves buying $1000- $3000 props that are what I call of two different classes of props. The "hidden prop" that deploys fast, or does the "unexpected". Hidden props I purchased were from Adam of Poison. Dropping clown flailer...$1100 - no one sees it coming...then it is there in their face attacking from above. The torso drop reacher same thing ..will come from hidden place from above. Not "WOW!!" but effective. Told him his stuff fits my needs and he told me it is harder and harder to make animations in that range with several movements. I then trade these off in trading circles to keep my place fresh. Same prop or set up year after year and the customers get bored. I keep adding new inventory AND trading. I keep getting bigger and never the same show twice. I talk a LOT with customers exiting the haunted trail. They tell me which haunts in the area have the exact same layout as the last 3 years. That is why they now go to my place...I'm always changing. Distortions props where actor hides in plain sight almost and does a great unexpected move is part of my arsenal with currently 2 of their "shock" line rotating among fellow frind haunters places.

So...I get a feeling the general consensus is "30% down from 2011". Im guessing it is just that people went to two haunts last year instead of 3. I WILL NOT reign in my show upgrades this year based on last years numbers across the industry. NO WAY IN HELL!!! I'm doublin down and going for broke before I go conservative this fall. My guess is people will be doing MORE looking seeing who is offering the same old show as last year. And if you go with the same as 2012....your 2014 attendance will be a disaster. No my approach is not the blueprint for everyone. Also understand I routinely drop a few hundred thousand dollars to put a crop in the ground and wait for it to rain the right amount. My tolerance for risk has been hammered into my soul for decades...I can live with that, some can't.

So Larry; your prediction that buyers will be out in June & July sounds correct to me; IF people want to have anybody to show up at their door in 2014.

Terrorknight
03-12-2013, 09:21 AM
I glad someone else brought up the Scarefactory DEATH HALL. Most dangerous thing i've seen in awhile being sold out there. It blinded me then hit me in the elbow with a wood door and at the end in the knee with a wood cabinet. REALLY !!!! Stupid design

Robert

wickedfarmer
03-12-2013, 09:25 AM
usually you will see me chiming in defending Scarefactory whne the 'gang piling" gets rediculous. I'll state that I am outdoors and have had no problems with breakage. Even told dave that this year at the show. But yeah...that hallway....absolutely ASSININE!

I stand corrected. I forgot about the hallway. I did go "WOW!" this year...but in a bad way. Walked through it after I made this years purchase from them.

But since the hallway safety came up I'll add that one spray/mister at Darkness hit the girl in front of me directly in the eye. She was very uncomfortable for long time.

Wicked Farmer

graystone
03-12-2013, 12:08 PM
I know I wanted to chill and relax from speaking. I have been speaking for a few years and figured it may be time for some other folks out there that might want to give it a shot. I don't think there was many or the oldies that has talked in the past. I think Larry still did maybe a few more. It did make me feel good there was some people coming up wanting to know why I was not speaking I told them the same thing I wanna relax and honestly I think everything and every subject has been covered by someone. Also I have seen so many times in the past the seminars seem to be infomercials for people trying to sell and push product. I myself have nothing to sell again this is just my opinion! And on the IRS Paul is 100% right and I know this first hand and I don't even do this for the money! Hell I am dealing with it now lol. Its a long drawn out process and your quilty till you prove yourself innocent! I also agree with Allen so many after hour events. No it does not hurt the show but I can say this I hope they made money in 5 years I have never made a dime and many times paid extra charges! I think Jen should combine her party with mine but I don't see that cause I am sure shes making some off her sponsors. I think it may be time to take a step back and breath some new life into the show. I know of several things that would add excitement to the show hopefully we can talk and work on new things to go along with the show. Shane and it's maybe were at a point where we need some changes?

Motograter
03-12-2013, 12:13 PM
I have to say the Dead House Designs Trailer was awesome!!! The Scarefactory hallway was dangerous like you guys are saying. I was warned by another haunter before I entered it for the first to walk real slow and to be careful.

Motograter
03-12-2013, 12:19 PM
I understand now Shane, I was going to chat with you for a few at the Ren when I saw you but you just kept walking away waving at me. I thought it was odd but I see you just wanted to relax.

Deathwing
03-12-2013, 12:24 PM
Vendors.. Meet some great new ones and chumbed up with some old ones.. Bought hardly nothing.. Half of last years order dollars wise .. Im with Larry that Unit 70 will get some $$$$ from us...
I think the show is really very slow and lame.. No offense to anyone but it is a very boring show. I walked the floor a couple of times per day and except for a few vendors I saw very few folks buying the goods.. lots of folks buying up the floor samples on Sunday.. That is real neat to be able to do if you can haul it..
I do have some advice for all those that sale cash and carry at the show including Jen at Transworld..
The IRS will be knocking on your door/booth one of these days.. St. Louis will figure it out and go back X number of years and burn each and and every vendor doing such.. Mark my word it will happen I've seen it first hand. You talk about headaches.. I dont think Transworld or the vendors are prepared for that kind of real TERROR....

Slain why does it matter if its legit and receipts are given its a sale like any other sale.

Jake

graystone
03-12-2013, 01:13 PM
Mike your right a sale is a but did you pay taxes on it? Nope! Many don't and your supposed to. Well for one you got cash and carry you should be paying tax on that and I assure you that no one added tax to the sales then, do you pay taxes on the product there, do you pay the taxes when you get home. Does the vendor charge tax. It really does open a whole lot of issues. Most don't pay tax when they are at the show so your expected to pay when you get back many don't! I would like to see all vendos charge tax on it so I don't to fool with it when I get back. Lots of issues the IRS likes this kind of stuff! Bill man I am sorry I did not talk to many and I don't want you to think I snubbed you at all. Please if I came off that way it was not my intent! Shane and it's next time just come jump in!

wickedfarmer
03-12-2013, 01:29 PM
As a "exhibitor" at a local festival last year I got a tax form from my state looking for the sales tax on my sales. Event organiser had to turn in list of exhibitors to the state. Cracking down on this more. I sent back their form with a letter stating I did not have any "sales", which I truthfully did not. I merely handed out my flyers for the upcoming of the maze and haunt season opening in a few weeks and met people face to face. Had been at this festival other years as well but 2012 was first they started sniffing around these type of events.

BUT THEY ARE CRANKING UP ON ENFORCEMENT OF THIS ISSUE FOR SURE.

Wicked Farmer

Michael Inks
03-12-2013, 01:36 PM
Shane, next time you give a seminar... I'm there!

graystone
03-12-2013, 02:01 PM
Michael anyone that knows me knows I am just a phone call away. I will be glad to offer any info and will help in anyway I can! Shane and it's anytime man!

Grimley
03-13-2013, 09:32 AM
Guess I was in the minority then. I thought the show was way better than previous years. We are more into the retail aspect and the selection and quality were far better than I expected. We bought masks from two new companies this year and we cant wait to get their stuff. There were several really cool costume and mask companies that stood out. Was not wowed by any of the new digital effects from any company this year. They all just look fake and seeing them in the darkness just sealed their fate in my mind. They run on a loop and take too long to execute. Everyone was stopping trying to see each one in turn. I can only imagine that being a nightmare unless they were using it as Q line entertainment.

Thought Gore Galore was really on point this year. The trailer haunt in the darkzone was very well done. Midnight studios and creepy Collection both had very nice props. Tom Devlins new over the head masks looked great. I enjoyed the interactive haunted house. Thought they did a really good job considering the time.

Gore Galore
03-13-2013, 12:52 PM
We really appreciate the positive comments.
Grimley, and others. thanks
I have thought about super detailing our booths, but prefer to focus on product rather than the booth. But it does help to showcase the product by giving it a background or scene to be seen with. It helps buyers see the potential in the product.

In regards to the IRS or the MO dept of rev trying to get sales tax from vendors. You are dead on. That is why we do NOT do cash and carry. Plus I find it kind of a hassle to prep all that product with no guarantee it sells.
IN years past Transworld did say this was NOT a cash and carry show. And because of the MO depart of rev showing up last year, and some vendors bringing the idea to transworld to again bar cash and carry atleast "officially". some will still happen but atleast recommend to vendors against it. Selling Display models is safe as far as taxation is concerned.

carnagecrew
03-13-2013, 01:28 PM
I had an excellent time at the show! Finally got my goat actormatronic from Kevin at gg - and picked up an awesome river monster mask from Allan. Learned a lot, drank even more. Looking forward to Midwest !

DynomiteDaniel
03-13-2013, 01:55 PM
First year and WOW...I am still freaking out. I can honestly say that I had more fun at this show than I can remember for the last 10 years. We got great new things from a good group of vendors. We waited too late for some of the masks we wanted from Stilt Beast but hopefully we can score something in teh next few months.

Thanks guys for a great show!!!

Choose Your Path!:evil:

Allen H
03-13-2013, 02:10 PM
Pretty muc all stiltbeast does is cash and carry. Since my masks are unique ordering is impossible. It is very easy to simply pay the sales tax in Missouri since that is where you are doing business.
Allen H

drfrightner
03-13-2013, 11:02 PM
A couple years ago the state of MO revenue called me trying to get info on the show because they wanted to hit up everyone for sales tax... I told them flat out its a show where people see products and write orders later. They only became aware of the show because some vendors called them and tried to pay taxes. The reality is most of the cash and carry is related to selling one thing here or there in your booth and that is what I told them. I told them because I knew the guy actually... I told them they would never get a dime from anyone and that most if not all the vendors are really only selling a handful of things from their booth and most of everything is simply orders like any other show. They told me OIC kind of thing and that was that... I haven't heard of them coming back at all.

I don't think that is really an issue honestly.

Because the show really isn't a cash and carry show unless you are selling like small little things like CD's or something small who can stock stuff? Again I wouldn't worry about it.

Larry

FrightProps
03-14-2013, 06:12 AM
Larry... Sometimes you make comments that make me go "huh? what?!" :)

Did you have a chance to walk the show floor this year? If you did then maybe you missed what I observed which was TONS and TONS of c&c everywhere.
Several booths had only c&c and no literature at all to hand out! They only brought product to sell on the show floor.
Several booths had printed signs saying "C&C!"

Doug.

wickedfarmer
03-14-2013, 06:21 AM
...that he didn't bring stuff for cash and carry as there was so much going on and he was told "it wasn't cash and carry show' Had latex stuff, pretty sure I saw Larry post a pic of the gal with the white skull painted on her chest. It was everywhere. Even if you didn't see it the stash was behind the booth...like a certain vendor I might or might not have bought a battery operated drill air horn combination.


Wicked Farmer

drfrightner
03-14-2013, 11:36 AM
That is the problem with message boards or any of this stuff ... I KNOW people are carrying stuff out the door this I'm well aware of. What I'm saying is and actually what I did say was its not really a cash and carry show outside the fact that people are buying the displays from peoples booths and well carrying them away.

Does that really make it a cash and carry?

Cash and carry in my opinion is something different... its a vendor or really the majority of the show bringing 100's of pieces and selling them right on the spot. Their goal isn't to take orders rather make money while at the show. Let me take a guess who many giant animated monsters Scarefactory can hide under a table, or how many gore galore monsters can be stashed behind a whatever.

What I'm saying is this show isn't a cash and carry but yes its true that some vendors dump their displays but in my opinion that really isn't cash and carry. I've been to shows and vendors had 100 pieces trying to sell them right on the spot, this show is mostly taking orders shipping later.

Larry

Rex W.
03-14-2013, 12:25 PM
Yeah tell me about it...we know first hand that you weren't doing cash and carry Larry - you had full racks of zombie costumes which we tried to buy 5 of and your staff told us we couldn't...so we went around the corner and bought from Brainchow Studios...they were taking orders and doing cash and carry - and doing very well I might add.

drfrightner
03-14-2013, 12:31 PM
I have no idea about that... I thought they were letting people have the costumes. I think the issue there might have been they wanted to keep all the costumes on the rack so people can look at them to place orders. I don't know but I will ask. Those costumes they made look really really good you should order some.

Larry

Rex W.
03-14-2013, 12:38 PM
Yes indeed your Zombie costumes did look fantastic - good work!

Rex W.
03-14-2013, 12:48 PM
For those that attended the "Price is Fright" what were your thoughts?

wickedfarmer
03-14-2013, 01:03 PM
I came across 3 postings right here on the forums advertising cash and carry at the show. Sure the large prop makers can't bring in several props and hide under the table. But there were stacks of small boxes in the dead space between the display backing and their neighbor on the other aisle. Yeah this can become a huge mess for future years. Well, it already is when one vendor is mad he didn't bring the 1 ounce bottles to sell cash and carry seeing all the cash and carry going on. A couple here on this thread said they did cash and carry. It IS going on, though the show isn't officially run that way; a lot more than just booth pieces but no where close to majority of vendors. In Michigan they started sending forms to each vendor (myself included) at a show..and it wasn't fun getting it sorted out proving I simply handed out literature...guilty till they were persuaded by reasoning I was innocent sort of thing.

Since Larry has already talked with "officials" it may go by for a few years as it is. But my guess is there will be more cash and carry items next year whether sanctioned or not. My suggestion having dealt with this first hand...let it go on as it will until State of MO. cracks down. BUT I would suggest dropping a sheet of paper on every vendors booth next year telling them to cover their butts...pics of booth showing no cash and carry items as silly as it sounds worked for me proving I had no sales. and those doing cash and carry better be ready to back out the % sales tax MO. wants. I am afraid if the no cash and carry was enforced we would lose a few vendors and that is not good. There is no good solution.

Wicked Farmer

KaoTic Entertainment
03-14-2013, 01:10 PM
We too tried too buy several costumes from that killer HP rack but were shut down and told could not buy till show close sun but we were leaving early sun morning . But would still be interested especially in the ragged and tattered bad ass orange jumpsuit it was killer and for 60.00 bucks i sure hope they list these costumes on the website hint hint Larry hope we get a chance to buy them .thanks cant wait too see them for sale again

Valley_of_Screams
03-14-2013, 01:31 PM
Why couldn't any vendor just charge a sales tax on each order of C&C items just to cover their asses? Problem solved. No different than going to Macy's and buying clothes...we all pay sales taxes. No biggie. -Tyler

wickedfarmer
03-14-2013, 01:55 PM
They should be charging sales tax...but do not always. Of course I am sure they back it out later and report it. The problem here in Michigan festival I went to was the State KNEW there was tax evasion going on (as explained to me) so they said "Fine...we will just send a tax form to every vendor registered at the show" The show provided them with my business name (trade name) not the official DBA (Doing Business As) which made it even more fun. MO. could literally walk the aisles, see the registrations, and send forms to vendors as a "SURPRISE" as they did with me.

That some do and some do not do cash and carry makes the show all the more prime target by the state to stick their heavy hand on. Of course THEY WOULD NEVER EVER dream of walking the aisles observing and send notices. And cops do not hide behind overpasses on the Interstate's either to ambush speed violations with a hefty fine.

Wicked Farmer

Greg Chrise
03-14-2013, 05:38 PM
You are worrying too much about sales tax when the booth spaces already pay directly to the city as the landlord of the convention center, collecting hotel taxes on 10,000 people showing up and it is all a pre planned system. Hassling 300 vendors because two to a dozen vendors do cash and carry and make 10,000 gross and have spent $4,000 to get there and bring money to the city in the form of being an event or attraction for business it the over all intention. It costs even a government money to try to follow up on all this minutia. Just to be a vendor you have to offer all of your regular federals business numbers and there is the taxation world.

A flea market where 4,000 people show up and are not registered businesses, yep they will make everyone get a business license for that town and register to pay sales tax because the place that the market is held is usually privately owned.

In the future the cash and carry percentage will most likely remain the same, a small percentage of the tradeshow orders. The trend is for most to not work ahead of time and risk hundreds of hours of work hoping for a sale of unique items. Rather to show what can be made and take orders.

In the larger order of things even tax delinquency isn't really gone after unless it is a significant amount of money like $10,000 in taxes or $40,000 in employee taxes. There is a veil of understanding that small business will never become big business if they are hammered regularly at lower levels. Taxes become one of those burdens and obligations that might otherwise be counter acted with other business deductions and things balance out.

Yes, several years down the road you can get hit for past events and income. It is kind of expected behavior that businesses may or may not become long term sustainable entities but, when they do, welcome to the world of taxation. Having lots of sales and having a gain are two different things. In the sales of unique hand made items, how much of that income was recovering all the booth expenses and travel expenses and the cost of the materials and labor paid to make things? Quite a bit. So in the bigger picture, someone may have sold hundreds of items and simply broke even on their labors. It isn't like you found crap left behind in a garage and hosed it off and are selling it for $100 because the market might pay that. These are all fully developed companies that will pay somewhere and I'll bet the city even gets a dib of the federal funding to make sure they have a convention center! So everyone is semi happy.

If there are 300 vendors there are probably 300 different catagories of tax payer identification and methodolgy as to what sales are even a gain at all or totally a promotional effort. Even making $10,000 or more in cash and carry does not signify those vendors total yearly income by any means and if it does, then they are given freedom to develop in a business and a market. There is a reason the booth spaces cost so much. The game for a $40 flea market table that hasn't paid any thing to the city or state versus paying $1500 or $2500 100 Square foot space where most if it goes directly to those entities are simply a different catagory of government income.

Say the government gets half of a $1500 booth space, that would be $750. If all the income came from sales tax on selling $10,000 worth of items that would be in sales tax about the same amount. It is done. It was paid. No reason to look over your shoulder. No reason to cover your butt or independently be a do gooder, you were yanked to even be able to participate in the convention as a vendor whether you made $10,000 or could only sell $1000 worth of some unique item.

Greg Chrise
03-14-2013, 06:19 PM
In short, sales tax is low hanging fruit when you can get people to pay rent and cash in on a federal pool of money. They make generalities about the amount of money transacted in not just this one but all tradeshows and there you go. It is how the prepaid booth fee is established. A really high booth fee like this plus hassle and it is over. OR just charge everyone the average of the planet even if they don't make a dime. How great is that.

FrightProps
03-14-2013, 06:21 PM
This is a tough one for me. The show is evolving and changing rapidly. More and more activities, celebrities, cash and carry each year. This year c&c was everywhere. Several booths only had c&c and no literature.

I’m fearful that all of these changes, and especially c&c will harm the shows value for me as an exhibitor. It’s the only show that brings the big spenders and big exhibitors. I like that about TW and would hate to see that go away.

I’m not against c&c and maybe it’s a good idea. This show needs to find a happy medium between no c&c, no celebs, no fun and garage sale, a fan show, a party.

Larry… From what you are saying I can tell that you did not walk the show floor during opening hours. If you had you would have seen cash and carry everywhere. As some people posted, you wouldn't sell c&c so they went elsewhere.

Doug.

Greg Chrise
03-14-2013, 06:36 PM
I'm sure Larry is intentionally not seeing all of these things.

All the things you mention though, the C&C, the parties, the seminars, the big purchasing clients are actually each a different segment of the whole. Each one has a different customer matched to a different type of vendor. You have owners, investors, buyers, actors, set up people, and just enthusiasts all wandering around in the same space.

Some vendors are there to sell $10,000 worth of inventory and some are there to take $100,000 worth of orders. Or perhaps selling everything that was your booth on the spot could fall somewhere in between those incomes or certainly allow for break even on how much it cost to do the trade show.

You have to go with who your client is. Cash and Carry doesn't cheapen the whole thing, it is only a segment of what is happening. The high dollar buyer isn't doing cash and carry for $150,000 worth of stuff. The enthusiast isn't writing orders for $30,000, they are walking out with one $20 or $100 item.

It isn't really competition, it is complementary. IF you seperated out all the different catagories of who is being serviced at any particular show, and segmented it, it would be pretty lame overall.

Deathwing
03-14-2013, 06:39 PM
I do see Transworld trying to become all things for all people. I worry that all these extraciricular activities could detract for the real purpose of the show. Wasn't there talk of showing proof of spending at least $5k to gain entry at one time? It might sond like a lot to some but it's really easy if you buy one of the large costumes and animation or two, would cut back on the riff-raff??? Just thoughts to stimulate conversation.


Jake

Greg Chrise
03-14-2013, 06:39 PM
I actually went to THAT tradeshow.

KaoTic Entertainment
03-14-2013, 06:40 PM
Speaking of celebs i tried too approach gunner hanson twice at the show too get an autograph for my ten year old son who was
Waiting anxiously outside the convention all he qanted was him too
Sign his texas chainaaw massacre shirt that han gunners hero character featured on it
Gunner told me he would be back at his booth in 20 minutes i said ok great and we were even willing to pay the twenty bucks to have him sign a really cool glossy for him .i stood at the booth for almost an hour and no gunner not old was a ten year old child extremly disapointed but we never saw him the rest of the show on the other hand dee wallace and ivonna kadaver were extremly nice and very caring is there a place i could mail this shirt to get it signed and returned with a hlossey signed as well it qould make one lil boy very happy thanks
So much in advance

Darkangel
03-14-2013, 06:56 PM
Jake,

The riff raff you speak of is here to stay now that Transworld is charging. An enthusiast or even a hanger on can go if they want to pony up the cash but you are right that is away from being a serious trade show and will not help the vendors but it is what it is. Transworld might as well just open it up to the general public at a fee and let everyone in willing to pay and rake in the cash and even invite a horror convention to join them like the new show since its all connected now. Of course in doing so, I'm sure the top industry brass would break away and do a new exclusive show for them away from the rest.

DA

wickedfarmer
03-14-2013, 08:33 PM
Well Greg I guess you put in perspective the big picture. Going after C&C unreported might actually shoot themselves (the State) in the foot chasing away business they are collecting hotel tax and all other fees on. The form for this years festival where I got the tax forms generated from last year is sitting on my desk now. The hassle it caused me is the reason I have not sent my $200 the day I recieved the registration form like I normally did. I will. But good point they do not want to scare off the geese laying their golden eggs for part of an egg.

Wicked Farmer

drfrightner
03-14-2013, 10:51 PM
Doug,

Couple things... as you know because you are on the list I sent Jenny a list of about 10 things she should or shouldn't consider down the road. I do think all this stuff like the Price is Fright or blah, blah is all silly stuff that really takes money off the show floor. All the cash and carry might also take money from placing orders. The show is suppose to be an order writing show not MHC Part 2... no offense to MHC but that show is not a show where vendors hang their entire year on sink or swim so to speak. MHC is the fun show with all the things to do where you can let your hair down so to speak but every vendor I've spoken to who went to MHC said they lost money doing it. Its mainly a show at least from my view point where you do haunt tours, seminars are super cheap, you dress up, you go to parties, and yes there are some vendors as well. I don't want to see TW become MHC or vice versa.

They are both successful based on what they do well... I'm opposed to price is fright or interactive haunts, or all this other silly stuff that is going on now. The show should focus 110% on putting vendors and buyers together to do business without the least amount of distractions.

So I'm with ya... people carrying around whole entire booths is not good for the show. Having a bucket full of red set up badges and no one checks and anyone can run around the show floor also hurts the show. The security was really bad as well all the way around the board.

The show is getting a bit haunt haunter nothing wrong with that but then the focus isn't on the industry which is a 1 billion dollar industry... we didn't let people take our costumes out of our booths for a reason because you are not suppose to do that.

If we sold everything as the show went on how could anyone see what we had to offer? Personally after the show is over and I mean totally over if vendors want to unload their stuff and let people take it great but ONLY after the show is OVER!

I'm with ya 110%.

Larry

Tater
03-14-2013, 11:55 PM
Larry

You are totally missing the point of The Price is Fright...It was to drive people to the booths that took part in it. So the vendors could educate the people on the products, get pricing and support the industry. 35 bucks wasnt a make or break sale, and that was the cost to get in. Are you angry because it went on Saturday night making people decide to go to Price is Fright or The Darkness. Hell your haunt cost them 60 bucks a pop to see it....with that said NOW lets talk about taking money outta peoples pockets and hurting sales. On a side note...I didnt see you there, so how can you form an opinion on this event if you werent actually present and see it.

drfrightner
03-15-2013, 12:06 AM
Tater,

NO I could care less every year of this show there has been something planned for Saturday night... whatever association does their thing, someone threw a zombie party this year, price is fright, city museum or whatever else. No not at all.. I'm merely agreeing with Doug that the show might be getting much away from the core reason you are there. I could care less about anything else... in case you didn't hear Tater we had a line of a 1000 people, Gore Galore was there with 20 costume monsters, we had a half dozen monsters sliding around, 70 actors inside, and honestly it was the MOST FUN I've ever had there... I wasn't thinking about what else might have been going on. We did our haunt tour for this industry people who want to see a haunt in action with new scenes, animations, like an interactive seminar ... we don't make money on the event not even close! We'll do it again because people asked us to and because I actually had fun this year renovated the darkness and I had the most fun opening for people. I enjoyed all the responses and the feedback... but opening a haunt at a haunt show is kind like putting bacon on a hamburger.

Larry

austind
03-15-2013, 04:30 AM
I did not do either one I gave my tickets to Wicked Farmer for Darkness live I did not need to go twice in one week and just did not go to The Price is Fright because I was a little tired and wanted to relax and pack for my flight home. I went to Shane's for the first time just to see. I am a person thats I likes to do what I want when I want so I buy every thing I may want to go do and give them away if I don't go. I am at the show to buy and learn. Not to wake up too tired to do either, old fat guys need there rest. I did the Darkness VIP thing liked that we got to see areas I have not gone through before that was nice. I do think there are some people there to party and I did not see them much on the show floor so it did not bother me, so maybe that is who the other stuff is for I don't care I don't have to go its my choice but having at the show is fine with me.

Phatman

graystone
03-15-2013, 05:23 AM
I don't see anything wrong with the parties ect. They are all after hours and no way competes with the show. It gives vendors and buyers a chance to network after the show and something to do. That's the very reason we do the party and I know it works because of the support from the vendors we get. We promote them and the donations show's that the vendors support the event for the buyers so everyone wins in a positive way. It does not take money from the show that's just silly really to think that because they either buy or they don't. I have never said oh do I go to the party or whatever or do I buy this $5000.00 prop If that's the case tell them to shut the bar down I don't drink but I do know they are like 7.00 a pop!!! People know what they want, they know what they want to do, they know what they want to buy. I like seeing all the events yes it can get to a point where there can be to much when I started my party it was just me and Larry's event but hey just as us anyone can do them. Just realize your not going to make a dime!!!! The celebrities everyone tells me they love them we do not make a dime on that either it cost rooms, food, booth, travel you name it I know me and Paul are the ONLY VENDOS WHO DOES NOT MAKE ONE DOLLAR BUT IT'S OUR WAY TO GIVE TO THE INDUSTRY AND SUPPORT THE SHOW! I think it add's a little wow to the show! Shane and it's no one needs a baby sitter we all know what we want or do not want to do!

wickedfarmer
03-15-2013, 06:09 AM
For ratting me out! Actually the couple in front of me and my one crew member had tickets someone just gave them too. I have another nickname besides Wicked Farmer in other circles..."two beers". Sitting at the Ren bar all night is not my thing and the show does end at 5:00. Been to Darkness twice now...and doubt I would go back next year even with someone offering me tickets from their combo with behind the scenes tour. Show room floor what little I heard Price is Fright seemed well recieved. AND the idea behind it wasn't just a time filler, but to talk to vendors you might have otherwise just skipped by so you knew prices of show floor items. The more vendors you talked too the better you were prepared for being a contestant. And the more you talk to vendors the more ideas you connect as to how you can incorporate their stuff in your haunt. I would probably go to that next year if it runs again. I am a haunt that spent about $10,000 at the show this year...$2000 with Doug. Truth be told I could have bought every single item I got easy without going to Transworld EXCEPT for House of Boo. But I go to keep making those contacts and plan my next years purchases as well and how my haunt show will evolve. I need something besides the bar, City museum and Darkness to gather with others from 5pm on after the floor closes.

Larry I hate finding myself on other side of you on this thread. But it didn't stop me from sending you a PM about a custom CGI effect. I guess we are all big boys and know the more we discuss, the better the show becomes hopefully. Greg; virtually said my suggestion/worry for vendors to cover your butt on sales tax was shown to be much less important than I had said when putting the WHOLE picture into focus. And that is why we are all here after all I guess. Had Custer sat around the camp fire and discussed with others more instead of holding to his plan he wouldn't died at Little Big Horn. Do the Darkness again man! People will come. But do not be too quick to poo poo the other events. Without them I would probably start going every other year as easy as I can do business without the show. And Graystone never been to your party...probably never will, but as long as people like it do it. The city museum will run its course too.

Wicked Farmer

graystone
03-15-2013, 06:36 AM
There you go. You either go or don't want to go and that's just as it should be. As long as it continues to be supported and everyone has fun I will keep doing it. I will say this the party goes on till 1:30 but I left at 10. I did my job, Sue is the Best Host and that's where it begains and end its all about people having fun! I know Ben did the event for the very same reason he want's it to make sure everyone has a chance to do everything they want or may not want to do. Shane and it's there you go! :)

Nic Miele
03-15-2013, 06:52 AM
To be honest..
-Show Floor
I think this year was the start of a change, some vendors are now starting to think out of the box and stepping it up while others are still stuck on lame mode haha. For Example Poison Props really stepping it up with his animatronics making them more life like with there movements. Dead house Designs trailer was just bad ass. So much detail and it didn't even feel like you were in a trailer. Another company took the simple vortex and made the platform tilt. That right there reminds me of Dyson, they took simple hand dryers and turned them into to the new high-tech ones. The mannequins that were animatronics were awesome as well! Also Scarefactorys new inflatable! Thinking outside of the box and BAM look Larry said he bought 2, my friends zombie paintball is buying 2, my haunt is buying one. Things sell when you do something different.

-Darkness
Larry you said you don't make money on it... please inform me where all that money goes to haha Saturday alone you said you had over 1,000 customers... at $60 bucks each thats over 60k in one night. plus you were open thursday and friday...
You do a renovation with your haunt just like any other good haunts do. yea you spend more to make it as detailed, but you also have the "best haunt in america" so you kind of expect to spend more to keep such a high volume of people to come back.
So unless all the money that you had went towards actors and staff... you made a profit cause all that money you made went into your haunt..
Just saying lol

-The Parties
Okay I'm from Chicago. Their is like 30 events going on EVERY weekend here and no one looks at it as a bad thing.
People come to the party to socialize and have a good time, the more options we can give them at transworld the better! One year they go to the darkness and the next year they want to try something new and go to the price is fright, or vise versa. Its about having a good time, networking, and learning more about the vendors. For the price is fright, not to be biased cause I DJed it, but I think that is going to be the new thing for transworld. It was its first year so there were a few bugs, but overall I believe people learned a lot from the 5grand in props that they were giving away for free at the event.
I also attended the darkness on Thursday which was fun seeing all Larry added. Next year I'm going to try and make it to the insane shane party.

-Taxes
well... if they haven't been paying them for the last couple years... vendors are about to get screwed pretty hard lol They do not play nice.

-Nic

austind
03-15-2013, 06:58 AM
I think TW is a show that you can choose what is your cup of tea and do the things that you want to do or don't go to the things you don't like. Just make the show your own show, with all the options it makes it fit all types of personalities. I am not a drinker but was at Shane's party and the bar most nights, it was a go place for like minded people to get together and talk shop. Every year I say I won't be going to the darkness but I see pictures online and go to see what is new, I went on the Zombie Safari last year and thought it was going to be lame but to my surprise it was fun. If we did not have options like that I don't think TW would be the show it is. Sorry for selling you out Wicked " Two Beers" Farmer but the ticket were expensive and it is good to make sure they get used.

Phatman

Darksidestew
03-15-2013, 07:12 AM
No Offense Larry, just trying to understand. You do not make money at 60 bucks a ticket?
But, in the halloween season you make money charging 20 bucks?
Even if you broke even you made something. It paid for your props or whatever....

Thanks,
charlie

Slain
03-15-2013, 07:20 AM
Speaking of celebs i tried too approach gunner hanson twice at the show too get an autograph for my ten year old son who was
Waiting anxiously outside the convention all he qanted was him too
Sign his texas chainaaw massacre shirt that han gunners hero character featured on it
Gunner told me he would be back at his booth in 20 minutes i said ok great and we were even willing to pay the twenty bucks to have him sign a really cool glossy for him .i stood at the booth for almost an hour and no gunner not old was a ten year old child extremly disapointed but we never saw him the rest of the show on the other hand dee wallace and ivonna kadaver were extremly nice and very caring is there a place i could mail this shirt to get it signed and returned with a hlossey signed as well it qould make one lil boy very happy thanks
So much in advance
Kaotic,
Send me your email and i will see what I can do..
Paul Johnson
atrox@windstream.net

Slain
03-15-2013, 07:28 AM
Larry, Did you happen to see the stuff going out of there on Sunday. It looked like a free for all. I know of one mask vendor that sold a couple of hundred mask cash and carry on the first day of the show. 300 to 400 masks at 25 bucks each is about $10,000 for one booth. Thats is a bunch of cash. Just something the board and transworld need to look at. At least the people selling the stuff needs to inform the buyer.
When weve bought stuff there and had it shipped... (In Alabama) It is called a user tax. You get hit with anything not bought in the state that you havnt paid tax on.. Go ask a good accountant.

Darkangel
03-15-2013, 07:32 AM
So did you see haunts bringing their whole actor crew again this year? That always confuses me they come wearing the same clothes and every single one takes catalogs but most have no input on your show other than to show up and try to scare guests on nights open. That's why I say Transworld nights as well make it a general public show since they'll basically let anyone in at this point, hell I went for years lol


DA

mindtumor
03-15-2013, 08:07 AM
What was the Price is Fright? I didn't see that advertised while I was there.

I disagree about removing the interactive haunted house, I would, however, not put actors in it again unless they are just standing around in a vendor costume or something. I think it looked better last year and it was pretty weak this year but I wouldn't remove it entirely. It isn't a bad showcase of stuff vendor's are selling. I would only remove it if the vendors just didn't feel like doing it anymore due to time constraints. Otherwise, I don't see the point in removing it.

drfrightner
03-15-2013, 10:33 AM
Sorry I have to explain this for the 1000th time... why don't I make money on these haunt tours let me count the ways! LOL. Because of my compulsive ways I believe that if I'm to do a haunt tour for this show it must be for a good reason. The good reason is to do something really incredible something whereby the people who attend learn something about building a haunted house or operating one. This has been a learning experience for me more so or as much as it has for anyone who has attended. In all the years prior to doing this show I always went all out on the Darkness but to the tune of my 50% or less the money invested, and or 50% or less on the time spent doing it, and lastly never have I spent that kind of money from the day we close to March.

After the tour is over we have to wait between 6 to 7 months to re-open to get some if not all of that investment back... the very first year we did this it actually almost bankrupted me. Seriously. I've been told multiple times to just open the way it was the previous year and charge 20 bucks, but my thinking is no way... that is no fun, that is not exciting, and why would haunters want to do that? I will have new idea's, no concepts, and something worth seeing or I won't do it at all. As long as the people who come to the tour tell me to keep doing it we will or when I run out of money, which will probably happen, LOL, or I run out of idea's. All possibilities!

I never got in the haunt business to make money, I did it because it was very enjoyable for me, and I've been accused by partners that I spend to much money, and don't focus enough on making money. This is actually true and the pressure I feel because its the haunt industry drives the needle to a point where you just can't make money but as long as I can make it to Halloween season I'll live. I really do enjoy doing this for the haunt industry this year more than any other.

Hauntworld is actually another example of something that doesn't make money for me... all the way up to this year I spent it all on new graphics, new features, cool things, I mean lets face it there isn't a lot of things this site can't do but it cost a ton of money. On Hauntworld I've finally just about run out of idea's so I haven't spent a lot in the last 12 months but I'm always wondering if there is something I haven't thought of yet. LOL The magazine is another I print it on the best paper, I hire Brainstorm, it doesn't sell enough advertisement but I keep printing it because people in the haunt industry enjoy it.

Larry

austind
03-15-2013, 10:47 AM
I liked the idea that you make it a demo for how to build a haunt. You have these guys that are haunt designers and you let them each design a room and build it during the show. I think Larry may have suggested that you make like a reality TV show where vendors battle to be the winner and maybe give the title of builder of the year to the winner. I work with Autorama every year and guys build cars just to win the title of the Riddler. Chip Foose spends six figures or more every time he puts a car in for the show. I know that a lot of people think that it is nice to have the auction for the haunt but that limits how much money you can spend on the rooms and make them really nice. Lets face it nobody will put $10,000 in a room that sells for under $2000. I just think it would be nice to see the best stuff money can buy, that is why people go to the Darkness, to see what is possible with a uncompromising budget. From what I have been told Larry spends more a year than most of us have for a build budget for 5 years, I don't remember seeing one black plywood hallway in the whole haunt. If that sounds like I am jelous then you are right wish I could do the same, doesn't everyone. I want ideas and the interactive haunt did not do it for me this year.

Phatman

mindtumor
03-15-2013, 10:48 AM
Hauntworld is actually another example of something that doesn't make money for me... all the way up to this year I spent it all on new graphics, new features, cool things, I mean lets face it there isn't a lot of things this site can't do but it cost a ton of money. On Hauntworld I've finally just about run out of idea's so I haven't spent a lot in the last 12 months but I'm always wondering if there is something I haven't thought of yet. LOL The magazine is another I print it on the best paper, I hire Brainstorm, it doesn't sell enough advertisement but I keep printing it because people in the haunt industry enjoy it.

Larry

I've got an idea for Hauntworld and I think it might make money.

wickedfarmer
03-15-2013, 10:52 AM
I swear you must have farmer blood in those veins somewhere. Spending all that money and skating through till "harvest/haunt" season. At least I have made decent money the last few years farming. Of course last year was thanks to Adam (Poison) who sent me rain.

Wicked Farmer

austind
03-15-2013, 10:55 AM
Larry I know I asked this before but not sure you gave a answer. How much more work do you do to the Darkness from now to you open? Or do you focus on your other haunts?

Phatman

drfrightner
03-15-2013, 11:33 AM
Good question...

After the show was over we continued the repairs on the Scarefactory T-Rex. I must have spent 5 or 6 thousand dollars on this thing now and finally it works like new. We totally rebuilt it, resigned it you name it. We tried to get it working for the tradeshow but couldn't so we worked on that. We will work on the darkness VERY VERY LITTLE if that answers your question.

I'll be honest I go to the show I see stuff and sometimes I'm like man I'd like to buy that and build a scene around it but can't... we are dead BROKE!

I have just enough money to get Creepyworld open and that is it! I will borrow money to open from a LOC.

So I guess my point is as to the Darkness tour, yes it makes dollars, and it helps to pay for everything to put on the event but in the end we sit around for 6-7 months waiting to get all the money back. Its okay it was fun. I live life for today not tomorrow its a flaw yes but that is how I live.

We will start on Creepyworld Monday.

I'll upload photos!

Larry

drfrightner
03-15-2013, 11:41 AM
Shane,

Just FYI... your party is the day the show starts like a kick off. You kind of started that and its doing great. I think the main point myself and others are making is there are too many parties, to many events that seem out of place to a buyers show. The show should be first and foremost a buyers show not an enthusiast show. I think its getting out of hand all the things you can do which maybe should be refocused on buying products from vendors or education.

I think overall from what I've been told the education wasn't strong this year and the attendance reflected that... these seminars didn't have the attendance that we've seen in the past. Maybe because there is to many FUN things people are spending their money on maybe... or simply its because attention is spread in 50 directions or maybe the speakers suck. I don't know.

Also again on this interactive haunt I thought it was simply not good... there is nothing educational about it, and honestly I personally do not feel it helps a vendor sell anything. I think moving that thing in the middle of the show floor making it smaller, better, would serve that cause better. Or simply as suggested do a haunter build off, or some sort of demos there with a stage showing how vendors use their products.

I'd much rather see that than some half-hearted attempt at a haunted house. I agree with who ever said it don't do actors again that probably made it worse! I simply think its time for an overall change of direction here just simply do something new and fresh!

Larry

KaoTic Entertainment
03-15-2013, 11:45 AM
Hello tried to buy several costumes from your booth . But staff said could not sell till close of show sunday
We were leaving early sunday morning .especially want the orange jumpsuit
60.00 bucks is what show price was i belive .please let us know how we can get these
As dont see them listed on the web page thanks and had a great time in st louis will be back again next year .

austind
03-15-2013, 11:46 AM
Great I loved the time line photos of the darkness, then you go on the tour and see it in perspective. I don't know about any body else but I like to see the process of construction and then the finished product.

Phatman

mindtumor
03-15-2013, 12:38 PM
An onsite build off would be cool but would you just end up having a long line sitting there all day staring at the build off? That sounds congested. Maybe it could be done in the off hours, or the day before. I honestly wouldn't give up on the interactive haunted house yet, but I would tweak it. It was pretty bad this year, but I liked it the last couple years. I don't understand if you are saying its a waste of time for vendors or the buyers walking through it?

Instead of making the interactive haunted house a build off, you might just make another stage or something and do set build demos kind of like the make up demos. You could even do just like 1 or 2 sets and have several people work on it at different scheduled times. Then give that schedule to people so they could see the people they want to see working on the sets.

Tattoo
03-15-2013, 12:54 PM
First off I want to thank everyone who has posted comments (both positive and negative) about the Interactive Haunt, I appreciate constructive criticism as it helps me grow as an artist, an individual, and business person.

I wanted to take a moment to explain how the IHH works.

A few years ago TransWorld approached me with the idea of building the “Interactive Haunted House” on the show floor. Knowing full well what our time constraints were and the challenge of coordinating all of the participating vendor products into the themes we chose, I met with our team and they were all up for the challenge. The first year proved to be the most difficult as it was our first attempt at it, building wall panels at a local vendors shop in St. Louis (thank you by the way), dealing with local building and fire inspectors, explaining the first time idea to vendors, and detailing, decorating, running sound and lighting all on the show floor while trying to meet the tight deadlines we had.

We also found out how quickly scenes can change (and suffer) when vendors show up without the promised items for the scenes.

TransWorld owns the IHH, we are given a small budget to build it for them. The idea is to auction it off each year in hopes of making the budget back to be used for the next year. We quickly found out the first year that by building a “micro-haunt” we would be effectively unable to make the money back so year two we decided to approach it with separated scenes like we did this year (our 3rd year)

We now build the wall panels for the scenes at our shop in Massachusetts however, ALL of the scenes are painted and detailed right on the show floor in St. Louis each year as well as all the wiring for sound, lighting and air.

We usually design the scenes to be square to aid in the ease of set up because of our tight time restrictions (Approx. 36 hours to set up)
We had 65 participating vendors this past year (imagine the amount of phone calls it takes to coordinate all of this) the goal of the IHH is to give examples of how the vendor products can be used in different themed environments. I know for a fact the IHH has led to major increases in sales for several vendors and that’s the #1 reason TW offers it each year, to give their vendors more visibility and another avenue to help increase sales.

My team and I do not get paid to design and build the IHH, we do it because of the passion for this industry and wanting to give back to the vendors who work so hard to help all of us. For me, it gives me a chance to teach my team how to stay focused, organized and meet deadlines so it’s a win win there.

We will continue to build the IHH as long as TW continues to ask us to do so and I will continue to learn from the input everyone gives here and via email.

I have posted a few pictures at the following link:
http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.588470904516064.1073741825.328748947154929&type=1

Thanks again and I wish you all a safe and successful season!

Mike “Tattoo” Krausert

P.S. I love the idea of a scene build off as well!

mindtumor
03-15-2013, 01:00 PM
I would also like to say that seeing some of the props displayed that way helps you actually find them on the show floor a little easier. I don't know why but walking the show floor the last 2 years, I have missed several cool things in vendor booths. Seeing them in the interactive haunted house with a name attached actually helps. I think getting rid of the interactive haunted house is a bad idea.

Also, once again, what was the Price is Fright everyone is talking about? I didn't see it at the or advertised, what exactly was it?

austind
03-15-2013, 01:32 PM
Thanks Mike that helps understand what you have to deal with. It did not seem that you had as much participation frome the vendors this year. There were what seemed to be lower cost props than normal. I did not know you were not paid to do IHH, and that is surprising when you see how much time your crew puts in to building it.

Phatman

KaoTic Entertainment
03-15-2013, 01:37 PM
Thought you guys did a Fantastic job on the IHH and it was truly well detailed
And one of the highlights of the show for us Thanks for being there and cant wait too see the IHH
Nezt year for sure again .
PS can you tell us what vendor had the barrel prop in first room that maid that killer sound coming from it .thanks
And keep up the great incredible work for 2014

Speculo
03-15-2013, 02:54 PM
A lot of these events are extensions of the Tradeshow because they give us another look at products. The IHH to me is so much work - to me it has a vibe like the Darkzone - another way to show certain products in a natural setting, and some extra free show space for the vendors to display a few more items than they have room for. I am sure the vendors and Transworld are very happy you do it, major kudos to Tattoo and his crew.. Thank you for working so hard! I was a part of the Price is Fright, but it was John LaFlamboy and the Zombie Armys baby. They really rocked it.. lots of work went into building the games, the staging, and once again vendor coordination. The funny thing was I was up on stage and saw one of the props and went... "oh yeah I was going to get that" so the first thing Sunday I went to Creative Visions and picked it up. It worked on me!

FYI: The Price is Fright was a Gameshow like the Price is Right where haunters guessed prices and played games like the show.

Shanes party and The Darkness tours were also showcases for products and fun things for folks to do. There are maybe 6000 people or so who come to this show, it seems like there are a lot of events but in reality there may not be enough!

Anyway thanks to everyone who works so hard on these events and tours to provide education and fun for us.... A lot of work for little to no return in most cases. Many attendees will never go to these events and that is fine - as long as they go to the most important one of all and support our vendors.... the one that runs all day for 3 1/2 days... The Show Floor!

Thanks!

Grimley
03-15-2013, 08:01 PM
I actually seal more deals after hours than at the show. Dinners, parties and city museum are the very best place to network even if it is a buyers show. The big deals are made by networking and not on the show floor.

drfrightner
03-15-2013, 10:46 PM
I don't think the point is to rip on these events but highlight the fact that from a vendors point of view that the show focus should be on putting buyers and sellers together not distract them with MHC style events every time you sneeze. I don't think the single issue is one party, or one event or one this or that its like the show seems to be moving way to much to an MHC style event and less on the main point. I think MHC does a great job incredible job and making the show to attend for parties, tours, events, and whatever else... lets not duplicate that show. Lets not create a perception that we want to be everything to everyone thereby losing your identity as the place to bring your check books and get some new equipment. The focus at least in my opinion is EDUCATION opportunities to make haunts smarter business people so they can make more money there by spending more money with vendors. We lose that opportunity when we focus way to much on entertaining people.

Now you also have Halloween Extreme or whatever that is ... hey make that the fun stop not the main show. No one is saying don't have fun but creating so many distractions and spreading yourself so thin everything gets weaker in the process like education. I didn't see to many people attending seminars this year maybe because they attended some other thing who knows. But we have an opportunity to really make an impact on these business we need to take it... that helps the industry as a whole and especially vendors.

I could creating after hour focus groups where vendors come and buyers tell them their problems with products, shipping, due dates, or how to build things different or give them idea's... you are going to tell me that would help the industry more than the Price is Fright? See in my book OPPORTUNITY LOST!

I could give vendors 10 truck loads of issues like making their products to wide, or welding on brackets on the inside of the frame rather than the outside, or whatever... see just opportunity lost to make the entire industry smarter!

On another subject... Interactive Haunt.

I think I made mention that I think and believe a lot of people work hard to put it together, there are many constraints especially with time needed... I think overall we've learned it can't be done on the level we'd like to see. Vendors are now bringing very very very detailed booths, and the interactive haunt falls way below that, additionally the show is very small and buyer walk the show multiple times there just isn't a need to showcase their products outside their booths.

I think we need something different something that really showcases vendors products... like a giant DEMO stage with TV screens right in the middle of the floor maybe. Let Vendors sign up for these demos and put on something that is truly interactive and educational at the same time. If we are to devote so many resources to something lets make it really work for the vendor and the buyers.

That is my two cents.

Larry

graystone
03-19-2013, 06:01 AM
This could go on and on LOL. Bottom line it's just once a year for most. I myself don't have time to go all these shows. I wish I could just don't have the time. I have a regular commpany to run and the Haunt stuff is just fun for me. Either way I think everyone puts 100% into making the show they best they can for everyone. Shane and it's making the best of it!

evilbeaverhaunts
03-19-2013, 11:07 AM
This was our second year attending, we enjoyed the show so much more this year than last, and we really enjoyed last years show.

As a pretty good home haunt, I like most people on Thursday & Friday talked with numerous vendors about their products and what they do and dont do, this year I made notes about what I want to buy and what I dont need (right now). I bought some cash-n-carry, but mostly ordered even the small items (TSA doesnt really care even a 4oz makeup bottle needs to be checked) the show floor is fantastic and to be honest my only real complaint and the one I heard from numerous people was that the floor show needs to be open longer, till 6:00 or 7:00?

The seminars; regardless of the level you are at this is a small comunitty and people talk, last year I was warned that the seminars are hit or miss not much in between, well I went to one last year about getting into the haunt industry it was a good seminar very informative and this year it was free. Also last year I went to another seminar with my wife and it was so bad I felt like I wasted an hour of my life and trade show floor time. The two seminars we attended this year were very good, but we were very selective in choosing to do any.

IHH; good to see how vendors showcase their material in a different setting, the actors this year were new (to me at least) and I really want to walk through it to see if I missed a product rather than have someone jump out, people then focus on the person not the product, imho.

The after hours activities; many parties and events to go to or not go to? Whatever each person wants to do is up to them, I can say if the show was open longer I would be at the show. I go to the show for the oportunitty to talk with numerous vendors, learn about their products and make informed buying decisions, this year I learned so much more than last year. The after hours events we went to were fun and a great experience we met and talked with home haunters to international haunters and numerous business owners, much more about networking after hours for us this year.

Just a small timers take ;-)

drfrightner
03-24-2013, 10:15 AM
Lucky industry ... next year the show is on this same weekend. Today in STL... SNOW! Its snowing here!

Thankfully it snowed this weekend and not the weekend of the show. This is totally odd its normally around 70 degrees by now!

This is the coldest March ever.

Larry

austind
03-24-2013, 12:35 PM
It's global warming? Got in a conversation today with a tree huger and the said that it was cold because of global warming. I had to tell him that the worlds temp (this is average temp for the world) has been down for the last three years. Heis only reply was its because of Obama. I want to know where you get what he is on. How's that global warming down in St. Louis Larry.

Deathwing
03-24-2013, 12:39 PM
Actually a result of global warming does equal more snow storms in certain regions, much more moisture in the air.

Jake

wickedfarmer
03-24-2013, 01:33 PM
...that the main head of IPPC or what ever that group is is THE same guy who was warning us the world would freeze when I was in grade school reading the current pantload from tree huggers of early 70's.

Wicked Farmer

austind
03-24-2013, 02:34 PM
DW I was talking about the temps. Average temp for the whole world is Down over the last 3 years and the temps for march have been on average for the US down 15 degrees. Stop using Al Gore math and look at the facts and experts that are not getting paid to come up with conclusions to suport he polices of groups that benifit in research grants. If we want to stop CO2 emissions then we need to stop beating up on ourself and go after China who produces more CO2p gases a month than the US per year. I learned how to read in grade school and don't believe any thing untill I check the facts for my self. Just like the goverment keeps talking about we need more taxes to pay the deficit down but the US will take in more funds in taxes than ever in history this year even if we don't raise the taxes. WHY? Stop spending so much. Also if it were not for the temps we would be talking about rain not snow.

Deathwing
03-24-2013, 02:50 PM
So you check the facts yourself before believing? So you did the research to confirm global warning and Al Gore and the many scientists who do study the facts have reported are all wrong, based on your personal research? Are the increase in tornados in the south and hurricanes out east just a coincidence? It's not a democrat or republic issue about global warming its obvious the climate is more turbulent these days.


Jake

austind
03-24-2013, 04:23 PM
I am not a republican, I am a person who deals with places outside the US and right now the talk in Europe is another mini ice age in the next 100 years. National Geographic will be doing a series of shows this summer on it. The biggest issue is that the world getting warmer is not half as bad as it getting colder. If we lose a 3 degree average in the US we would be unable to produce enough food to support ourselves, we can over come heat but not cold with technology. There have been 5 studies covering this out of Europe over the last 4 years and it has the governments over there very concerned. If you would like I can send you links to the studies and my synopsis of the NG broadcast media package we are currently working on for them. This is not crack pot political stuff, it is good hard research done without influence from companies or university personal gains. You may have heard that there is a big movement in the Green Peace group about going away from and distancing themselves from the global warming stance. The Media in the US does not cover a lot of things that you can read in Europe. If we really wanted to do some good for the environment then we should start with the worst abusers like Mexico, South America, India and China. I was just like alot of Americans a 20 years ago before I got a different view from traveling abroad. I was not trying to be critical, but our press here in the US seems to have their own agenda now days.

austind
03-24-2013, 04:27 PM
Just a side note there is a reason that Al Gores own party won't stand with him on this subject. If you fact check his research most of the global warming experts won't side with Gore. He is just media grabbing. This is not what this tread was here for so that will be last I post on this subject.

drfrightner
03-24-2013, 04:41 PM
These are pictures of my house... this is the same exact weekend as the show will be next week! Thankfully it happened this year not next.

Larry
1593215933

austind
03-24-2013, 04:47 PM
Well at least the kids will love missing school. Should save that pic for your Christmas cards next year. My guys got out of town just in time we were working at Busch Stadium till Friday and got out of town before the storm. We maybe from Michigan and are used to snow like this but we are not stupid. This would have made a trip back from TW fun if it were this week, maybe earlier was better this year. Larry call me if you need someone to send you a snow shovel.

Deathwing
03-24-2013, 06:27 PM
Good points Phatman.
Jake


I am not a republican, I am a person who deals with places outside the US and right now the talk in Europe is another mini ice age in the next 100 years. National Geographic will be doing a series of shows this summer on it. The biggest issue is that the world getting warmer is not half as bad as it getting colder. If we lose a 3 degree average in the US we would be unable to produce enough food to support ourselves, we can over come heat but not cold with technology. There have been 5 studies covering this out of Europe over the last 4 years and it has the governments over there very concerned. If you would like I can send you links to the studies and my synopsis of the NG broadcast media package we are currently working on for them. This is not crack pot political stuff, it is good hard research done without influence from companies or university personal gains. You may have heard that there is a big movement in the Green Peace group about going away from and distancing themselves from the global warming stance. The Media in the US does not cover a lot of things that you can read in Europe. If we really wanted to do some good for the environment then we should start with the worst abusers like Mexico, South America, India and China. I was just like alot of Americans a 20 years ago before I got a different view from traveling abroad. I was not trying to be critical, but our press here in the US seems to have their own agenda now days.