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View Full Version : best material for cave walls



slash
09-18-2005, 06:24 AM
Let's have a vote for which material to use for cave walls.

HENDRIX76
09-18-2005, 03:19 PM
you can use structolite witch is a plaster our monster mud they both work great and i have used them both before in my years of doing a hounted house

HauntedWebby
09-19-2005, 10:00 AM
Monster mud is not durable if people are touching or hitting it. If you're just walking by that is what I'd use. If people are walking through, I'd find something much more durable then MM.

Chris
09-19-2005, 01:39 PM
I would probably go with stucco over chicken wire or pink foam. If you have a lot of area to do (and want it to really last forever) you might consider shotcrete or gunnite or something like that.

Greg Chrise
09-19-2005, 07:10 PM
I made one in 1998 that is still in use today and has been out doors all this time with very little maintenance. It is my own cement powder and acrylic product sprayed onto steel hardware cloth/metal screen sprayed on by hopper about 1/4 inch and painted. The main frame is rebar all welded together and the end result was 1/3 rd the cost of gunite 1/2 the cost of sprayed foam and it has an insulating quality that makes it feel like a real cave. The shot material is twice the cost of dry wall mud but it is intended for outdoor use on pool decks, side walks or facades of buildings. It can be tinted any color. It can be painted over with any type of paint or sealer.

We do apply one version of this stuff over our styrofoam relief scenery and wooden facades made to look like stone work. We can make stone, bricks, tile and marble. But, I'm sure no one realy cares. We do caves and facades and haunt panel details but, again I know no one really cares. It seems like only yesterday I was using this stuff making a facade for someone but I probably couldn't remember the formula. I'm not sure what I had for lunch today but, I do know know one cares.

Jim Warfield
09-19-2005, 08:53 PM
cave man care.
cave women too busy hiding in back of cave from cave man to care
cave man know what he had for lunch today, he's still wearing it's hide
check your shirt Gregg, what was your lunch?
just trying to help

redcrowdesign
09-19-2005, 09:01 PM
For better results first put some 5 inches screws in the wall to 'support' the wole stuff, then cover the wall with expandable foam untill you get the shape you desire, after that put some metal mail on it and spray some wet portland cement on it. To make it very resistant so it can get a fat guy slam you need at least ten layers of 1 centimeter each. This is NOT a permanent solution, you can take it off with a hammer and a crowbar. This thing should last at least 1 year, if it is exposed to hard use then it may crack off but the mail prevents it from falling so remember to secure the mail very well and By the way, if you are using the foam put some ventilation in your place if you don't want to get stoned.

Jim Warfield
09-19-2005, 09:07 PM
Or "Dead"?

redcrowdesign
09-20-2005, 06:03 PM
LMAO!!! that's a good one Jim :lol: but seriously. Years ago I worked in one of those places where they fix your car's body when you smashed it so badly, you know what I mean, I don't know how do you say it in english. Anyway, I was sculpting a custom car's bumper with expandable foam but my cheapass boss didn't gave me a gas mask so I was inhaling all those toxic vapors and when I finished the first part I was so stoned that I really was like drunk or something, I was so mad with him that I never came back the next day and the bumper is still half done. So I am the living proof that inhaling that crap for more than 8 hours in a closed space isn't lethal but it shurely makes you wish to be dead!
So anyone who is going to work with toxic crap should buy a 3M gas mask.

Greg Chrise
09-20-2005, 10:04 PM
If you put an additive in said concrete it will be permanent and adhere properly for years. Spray foam = permanent liver damage, no problem. A respirator sometimes is not enough as your skin absorbes things as well. So, we are talking the complete fall onsomble haz mat suit in the pursuit of a little halloween entertainment.

Ogg can not move head enough to see lunch skin? 105 degree temperatures and animal skins make Ogg not able to focus eyes? Ogg life suck.

redcrowdesign
09-21-2005, 04:30 AM
Liver damage??? :shock:

redcrowdesign
09-21-2005, 04:43 AM
Ogg can not move head enough to see lunch skin? 105 degree temperatures and animal skins make Ogg not able to focus eyes? Ogg life suck.

By the way, Talking about heat, I forgot to say this in the last post: it is very important to you to know that the expandable foam is very very inflammable, also when it is burning it produces very toxic fumes that may kill you very fast, it is not like a wood on fire, it is more dangerous, so if you are going to use this method don't forget to set your cave in a safe place, away from power outlets, light switches and other fire sources, also locate an extiguisher near the cave thing, so if it sets on fire you can keep the stuff under control. Remember, safety is first.

If you are scared now and you don't wanna use the expandable foam anymore then you can do the same stuff with 1/8 '' thick wire, some open mail and tight mail, first make the cave with the wire and the open mail and then put the tight mail on it, after that put a lot of layers of portland cement on that, but in this case the mail & wire thing must be very solid and resistent cause it will support all the cement in addition to the cave itself. If you got some extra money you can add some structural styrofoam to that to keep things neat.

slash
09-21-2005, 09:33 AM
Thanks for all the info!

Infoamtek
09-22-2005, 03:39 PM
While looking for information on making artificial rocks, I came across this book that sounds like a "must" for any scenic designer(I ordered one immediately).
"Artificial Rock Waterfalls
Rock Making Techniques
For the Professional and the Hobbyist"

It can be found at http://www.rockandwater.com/index.html along with molds, precast rock and other supplies.

Jim Warfield
09-22-2005, 06:36 PM
Always ask to see the rock's driver's license or I.D., just to sort out the fakes from the real rocks.
"Ok Mister Rock, tell me who your parents are."
"An old wet newspaper?"
"Wrong! that is the answer somebody who is called "paper-Mache" would give, you must be a fake rock!"
"And just where were you born, Mister Rock?"
"In a big bucket."
"Like a paint bucket?"
"Duh, yah."
"Wrong again! You sound as if you have some definate "Mud" in you family tree, you faker!"

jason
09-25-2005, 09:30 AM
is monster mud weather resistant? what are the downfalls of monster mud?

beardedbil
09-25-2005, 02:13 PM
A great wall design for caves, is to use burlap soaked in Ultracal 30 and painted like rock, it is much harder than plaster and will last...

redcrowdesign
09-25-2005, 07:09 PM
waita secound!!!!! so ultracal isn't the same thing that plaster and dentist gypsum??? I've ben using dentist gypsum for mask making cause there is not such thing as ultracal in mexico, I also use rubber cement instead of mask latex but I know the diferences....

can anyone tellme hat is ultracal or what is the diference between the other stuff???

beardedbil
09-25-2005, 07:17 PM
ultracal 30 and plaster like pottery plaster are NOT the same thing... Ultracal is super strong and will take a beating and plaster will not... but thats just my opinion.

redcrowdesign
09-25-2005, 07:50 PM
Yeah but the dentist gypsum is also strong, specially if you reinforce it with burlap... but is ultracal stronger than the dentist gypsum??? or they are kind of the same...

Infoamtek
09-25-2005, 09:21 PM
Ultracal 30 is closer to cement than plaster in that it is gypsum mixed with lime. This makes it harder than other gypsum plasters including dental stone.

redcrowdesign
09-26-2005, 10:29 PM
thanx, I'll search for some of that here in mexico

Mr Nightmarez
06-18-2009, 05:55 AM
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f387/hauntedweb/TunnelUp.jpg

Or just get a real cave like we did! lol