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Bill Schnell
12-05-2008, 07:08 PM
I wanted to get some opinions on adding another haunt tour to the convention in March. I own the Necropolis Haunted House in Columbia Missouri and would definitely be willing to get our haunt up and going for a night. I would be honored to have other haunt owners go through and provide feedback (we are always trying to learn and get better). Our actors put on a pretty good show (we are a mix of "old school" haunts and new, and we do touch our customers). However, there are a couple of issues. Issue number one is scheduling. I'm not sure where the tour would fit into the convention schedule (I will not do it any night that would conflict with the Darkness tours). The second (and probably bigger) issue is distance. Columbia is about 2 hours away from St. Louis. So, right now its just an idea. For those of you who plan to attend the convention, let me know what you think.

Haunted Illinois
12-05-2008, 07:49 PM
Well, the main tours of the Darkness (if I am not mistaken) are Thursday and Saturday nights. If you would open Friday night (March 27th), that wouldnít conflict with the Darkness tours.

Itís great to have choices, but distance may be a problem for people, especially those who came to the TW convention by plane. Those who drove there and had there own car would have more freedom and would probably consider the trek.

I personally would drive that far to see another haunted attraction, but I can't speak for the other attendees of Transworld.

N2SPOOKINU
12-05-2008, 08:30 PM
Well Bill I was thinking the same thing but I didnt want to go out on a limb by myself but you took the first step so here we go. Our haunt is also in columbia Mo. and we also would be willing to open our doors for a haunt tour the same nite as Necropolis if there is enough intrest in it. Our corn field just got combined last week so our haunted hayride and corn maze portion wont be available but we have Sarahs legend and Slashmasters Asylum available. Like Bill said, just let us know what you guys want. It's up to you.

drfrightner
12-05-2008, 08:42 PM
You should provide some info about your haunt like photos, videos, a link to your website stuff like this. Is the haunt inside, how big, blah, blah.

I personally live in St. Charles, so its only about 1 hour and 30 minutes from here but from downtown St. Louis I'd say a bit more than 2 hours but close.

Larry

N2SPOOKINU
12-05-2008, 09:15 PM
Fearfest is approximately 11,000 square feet split between the two haunted houses. a link to our website is at the bottom of this thread. We just switched over to our new computer system and all our pictures of our haunts are on the old system. I will try and get it back online so i can download some pics for you. Our haunts are indoors, we have the Blood n Bones cafe for our waiting/concession area. The cool thing about Fearfest is if you run a temporary show you will want to take a look at us. Our haunts are built under commercial canopies with steel walls. They basically look like morgan buildings with canopy roofs. Our temporary floor system allows the rain water to run under the floors and keeps our patrons dry. If you need any more info Larry or anyone else just pm me or e-mail me at fearfestmo@aol.com Thank you, Greg

Speculo
12-05-2008, 09:25 PM
This is starting to get interesting!

What night?

Thanks!

Dr. Haunt Chamber of Fear
12-05-2008, 09:32 PM
So Fearfest and Necropolis in Columbia! That's two of the haunt's I had on my list that might be possible to have on a Friday Night tour.

I know that I would attend on Friday night and the two hour drive is fine with me.

Bill Schnell
12-05-2008, 09:51 PM
Well it seems like friday night would have to be the night. It also seems like some kind of transportation would be in order (a bus?). Our haunt is in an old meat packing factory, approximately 10,000 sq.ft. all indoor. As I said earlier, we have an old school feel with a strong focus on actors but with some nice eye candy as well. Last season we completely re designed the attraction with a new focus on set design to go along with our scares. We pride ourselves on intensity. Our actors get very close and personal and we are one of the few haunts that do touch the customers. For the past couple of years we have also had a second 3D attraction, but it would not be available due to renovations. Check out our website (listed below) for our backstory (we have kind of created our own urban legend) Here is a link for some pics and I will post some videos of previous seasons.

(Just click on the image)

http://s101.photobucket.com/albums/m51/aragorn4179/Necropolis/Necropolis%20Pro%20Pics%2008/th_DSC_5456.jpg (http://s101.photobucket.com/albums/m51/aragorn4179/Necropolis/Necropolis%20Pro%20Pics%2008/?action=view&current=7cfa6562.pbw)

Bill Schnell
12-05-2008, 10:09 PM
Lets see if I can figure out this video thing... Here is our tv commercial from last season. The quality on this is not the best, I would highly recommend going to www.youtube.com/necropolishaunt and watching the high quality version.

Eohqa7HMeZU

Bill Schnell
12-05-2008, 10:13 PM
Here is a video from the 2007 season. Again I would recommend the high quality version at www.youtube.com/necropolishaunt Also remember that this footage is from before the re-design. Enjoy.

hpKP7ZlLK60

swampboy
12-05-2008, 10:46 PM
I would love to see your haunts and I am willing to make the drive.

Haunted Nashville
12-05-2008, 10:57 PM
Same here my crew of four will make the trip if you guys open.

stafford
12-05-2008, 11:03 PM
You guys should put it together, 2 hours is fine, we'd do it.

Chris

drfrightner
12-06-2008, 12:22 AM
If you want to do we'd be happy to promote it on our tour page.

If we can't get open you might do it on Saturday.

No matter we'd be happy to promote your haunt opening no doubt about it.

Larry

N2SPOOKINU
12-06-2008, 08:29 AM
I was reading some of the other threads. What about the HHA meeting? What time is that? It is set for Friday nite then a meet and greet. Any ideas??

Jordan24
12-06-2008, 09:40 AM
I'm one of the, I'm sure, many coming in by plane. So a two hour drive is going to be a problem for us. But if buses were pulled together I'd definitely make the trip out.

spookologist
12-06-2008, 10:01 AM
Hey Larry.....

Since you totally torn apart the old Darkness and might not be able to open in time why don't you let these other haunts open this year and you do next when the construction is totally complete. It sounds like it would be nearly impossible for you to open. Give these others a chance to show their haunt and it will give people a chance to see yours in 2010. Maybe without the added stress for opening you wouldn't have to charge as much. I personally don't see a problem paying $50 to see the Darkness but others may. The bad thing would be that I think having the Darkness open this year would give the new show a boost and be a huge draw.

Just my thoughts.

Wayne
www.trailofterror.com

drfrightner
12-06-2008, 02:48 PM
Wayne,

As you know we have taken on way to many attraction projects and now we're overloaded with work. I had a crew totally take down about 25% of the entire attraction and now no one to put it back together. On Monday we're going to clean our production studio and the building the Darkness is in top to bottom.

I finally got in touch with Jim about an hour ago and layed out the plan. We are then going go to Wisconsin to install an attraction when we get back we're going to chop our crew in half...half working on the Darkness and he other half working on these other attractions. We are going to keep the website www.thedarkness.com (http://www.thedarkness.com) up and running but not activate buying tickets for at the very least another month or so.

Our new building has slowed to a crawl because of weather and get this the building next door to us, their trash people backed one of those massive trucks into our building and crushed the corner of our building. So now that has to be rebuilt along with still needing sprinkler system, adt, three more windows, a door, fire proofing the staircase, electric, and the brick layers may not be done until March. This on top of the fact that we would still need to build Terror Visions.

So we are going to simply work on all of this through the first part of January and take another look and see if its possible to get this done before the Transworld show. All of those people who don't want to pay $50.00 can stay home I dont care what they think... I'm going to lose simply a TON of money doing this a TON!

The only real way I can get this done is to STOP taking orders for attractions, and put all of my own money into this and bust butt over the next 3 month to get it done but that is suicide. I can't afford to pay my staff of nearly 20 with no income from building attractions for clients.

I only know one way to do things... OVER THE TOP, and because of this show coming here, I wanted to GO OVER OVER OVER THE TOP and then OVER THE TOP AGAIN... I went way to crazy this time, and simply had more torn out than I should have and took on way to many projects, which I must have to keep my company going.

We have two attractions due in Wisconsin before the end of December and two more due in January. The soonest I can really get going on this thing would be February, but I'm sure another attraction is coming in in that month as well. We are going to work on the Darkness EVERY SINGLE that we can!!!

So we'll see...

As for this other tour they should shoot for FRIDAY, but they will need to get busses because that is somewhat of a drive. If everyone left around 7pm you'd get there around 9pm. This tour will end up being around $50.00 as well when you factor in a bus.

N2SPOOKINU
12-06-2008, 03:07 PM
Larry I dont want to take any limelight away from you or The darkness. You worked your butt off to get the convention into Stl and that is a great thing for all of us in the midwest. We are willing to help you in any way we can to make this convention a sucess. I cant speak for Bill and Necropolis but what ever Fearfest can do for you just let me know! Greg

drfrightner
12-06-2008, 03:21 PM
To open your haunted house for this event would be a MAJOR undertaking, you put yourself under the microscope, and everything you do wrong someone complains about, which makes you wonder why anyone would even try.

But if you for sure want to open your haunted house let me know we can add you to our website and help you if we can.

I would shoot for Friday though but you'd need buses and everything. It will be expensive and there is NO WAY this could be sold for less than $50.00 if not more dollars because of the bus ride. I'm sure that will cost a ton.

Look into it!

Larry

Nightgore
12-06-2008, 03:35 PM
Larry, if you need help I'm more than willing to come! Just let me know!

Either way I'm sure it'll get and I can't wait to see it! -Tyler

xxxdirk
12-06-2008, 03:36 PM
I would try to arrange busses to the show. Even if you have to charge a bit more, as long as people do not percieve that they are not being ripped off on cost, I think most of us understand that there should be a cost to go to a haunt and that a bus will cost money. A coach bus fits about 50 people. Not sure how much it would cost to rent one, but I am pretty sure many of us would love that option.

drfrightner
12-06-2008, 03:52 PM
A few years ago Teror on the Fox did that tour and I know it cost well north of $100.00 and I'm sure most of that went to bus rides. I'm sure they would have an idea how much this would cost because they have done it. You have to go there and back again and that will cost a lot of money.

Larry

N2SPOOKINU
12-06-2008, 03:53 PM
The busses are not a problem. We had to set up charters for some of the colleges that wanted to come here last year. Our shuttle bus we have only holds 22 customers and it works great for small groups but not near big enough for something like this. I know this would be a HUGH undertaking. I have already been in contact with many vendors for modifications that need to be made. Does having the best of the best go thru my haunt make me nervous??? HELL YES! But it is also an honor. Will some people complain? Like you said probably. We are an entertainment facility. We tell our actors if you cant scare someone try to make them laugh. We have already talked to our crew and they are very excited about the chance to be open this March for the convention. I personally was very excited to get the opportunity to do a lights on walk thru of The Darkness. You have a great haunted house! Is this still an option or are you cancelling the whole thing?

xxxdirk
12-06-2008, 04:07 PM
I have always felt sorry for haunt actors when haunters go through. On the one hand we appreciate the acting job, on the other we are not reacting like a 15 year old typical customer. JUst tell your crew give us their best stuff, but dont be surprised if we do not scream or whatever.....

R

swampboy
12-06-2008, 06:32 PM
Anyone who needs help opening in March, I am willing to come help for no charge...

scareshack
12-06-2008, 07:51 PM
The slide show of pics are awesome and the video is packed with screams! Looks like a place to check out.

If I get to go to the show I would deffiantly want to go to that haunt and see it.

SomeThingInTheIce
12-07-2008, 01:17 PM
We are driving from Florida, 15 hours, three of us 5 hours each, so two more hours will be nothing.

Haunted Illinois
12-07-2008, 02:32 PM
Speaking of people driving long distances, perhaps you should offer two ticketing options.

1) Tour with bus transportation included.

2) The tour only, for folks who would rather drive to the event themselves.

Just a thought...

drfrightner
12-07-2008, 03:41 PM
IF they pull the trigger on this tour it should be BUS ONLY... its way to far for directions when you have a very short window to open the attracion. If someone drives down there gets lost and finally finds it and the tour is over.

It should be BUS only. I talked to these guys last night and I hope they get their tour together for Friday night. We'll do everything we can to help them!

Larry

Haunted Illinois
12-07-2008, 04:13 PM
Then maybe the tour of The Darkness should be “bus only”, as well. There is a chance that someone may get lost. LOL.

Larry, they should give people an option. A great number of people from the Midwest area will be driving to TW, which means they will have the means to drive to this attraction on their own. Giving everyone a price-break will entice more folks to go on the tour.

While bus transportation is convenient, it can also be a pain in the a@@. I personally like the idea of being able to come and go as I please. The part about bus tours that I really hate is having to wait for the next bus to show up, before I can leave.

As for people getting lost, let me say this. If they do, it’s their own fault. This is the age of technology. I’ve already mapped the Haunt location out on Yahoo Maps, Google Maps and Maps.Live.com (formerly MSN & Mapblast sites). I also have the address programmed into my GPS.

There is no reason that people should be forced to pay for a bus, when they can (and want to) make it there on their own.

drfrightner
12-07-2008, 04:45 PM
Adam,

The suggestion of having people drive 2 and half hours and not take busses only is totally the worst idea I've ever heard. You talk about potential nightmare waiting to happen... that is just a horrible idea!

Tell me Adam, are you going to have all the cars line up and say ready, set, go?

Otherwise people arrive at all different times, some get lost, don't don't make it, and everyone is showing up at all sorts of different times. TERRIBLE IDEA!

It shouldn't even be an option unless you want total chaos... as for The Darkness it is less than two miles away totally different story.

Larry

Nightgore
12-07-2008, 05:00 PM
We won't be attending this if there isn't a bus there... simply not going to make the drive! -Tyler

Haunted Illinois
12-07-2008, 05:48 PM
Actually, the drive should only be a little more than two hours, not two and a half hours, as you suggest. Even so, what is the problem with that? Is the general public incapable of making such a trek on their own? As I stated before, there are technological aides, such as online mapping programs and GPS. For those who arenít so good with directions, they always have the option of taking the bus tour, right? As for trusting busses, how about the bus drivers who got lost for the Transworld Vegas tour. I would rather drive myself, thank you!

Also, there have been other Transworld Haunt tours where people were given the option of driving themselves and things turned out fine.

Oh, wait.. Maybe your objection has nothing to do with transportation at all. Perhaps you want to keep the cost of this other tour as high as possible, so the $50 price tag of your own tour doesnít seem so unreasonable?!?! That does make sense. After all, you did erase the thread of several people complaining about that very subject. Coincidence? Perhaps not.

Jim Warfield
12-07-2008, 06:03 PM
Done that. Send the money to the Bus Co. and then watch the mailbox for the checks to show up before the last possible cancellation day arrives.
I finally informed my wife that if at least a bunch more checks don't show up on Monday that we will have to cancell......that Monday I was pleasantly surprised to find about 5 more checks there, now we had the bus paid for if nothing else!
So everybody remember to wait til that last possible moment to reserve your ticket, no use making it too easy on anyone now is it?
As far as touring other haunters through my house.....nobody criticized it to my face anyway because many of them were actually in fear for their very lives! (Too scary? Too scary on a new undefined level?)
Years later there were some critics in such a group , they were all young punks who were pizzing and moaning because they were not finding the standard fare here..yet the haunt owners in their group were marvelling at what they saw and experienced here.
You can't win them all!
Sometimes heavier criticism follows unrealistic expectations from borderline false advertising, sometimes it just comes from a ticket being priced into the" precious" zone.
Most normal people aren't going to be critical of an under-priced haunt.
Under-priced for the value of the experience given.

JamBam
12-08-2008, 05:43 PM
We will be driving and it sounds like many that are responding are as well.

The tickets can be set up by the hour no matter which way you come by. "Bus only" will eliminate us as it would strain our budget for the amount of people we will have there.

Besides, buses can get lost: Viva Haunt Vegas buses got lost in March 2008. I was on one of them and it started out pretty overwhelming for all involved. Also, the original TW tour to Raven's Grin Inn got slightly lost and alheimers combined. The old boy driving didn't drive any faster than his wheelchair he had.

So, Columbia haunts, and maybe a couple along the way, maybe you want to do a I-70 Gateway Haunt Tour!!

poison
12-08-2008, 07:05 PM
Your Haunt looks Amazing!!!!!
I WOULD LOVE TO SEE IT.
One bus ticket PLEASE!!!!

Jim Warfield
12-08-2008, 07:11 PM
That bus company tried to bill me a few months later for the extra time incurred!
Even though the driver got us lost, going against my directives I gave him as I stood next to him as he was driving through Dixon, Ill., 45 miles from my home.(Like I don't know how to get home?) From Dixon!?
Remember once the bus got on rt 88 headed here he kept stopping every so often then seemed to be looking for spare change that might have rolled out of his pocket or something?
I was told by one of my visitors a vendor, the next day at Transworld that when he woke up on rt88 headed back that the bus was only traveling about 25 miles an hour, on route 88!
It would have been very unfair to everyone else on the bus to have to die, getting rear-ended by a speeding semi at 2am just because the driver needed or wanted to die.
Then after I sent the bus company a detailed letter about that night and they said I didn't have to pay them, a month later they billed me again! So I re-wrote that sad, miserable experience down and mailed it to them again!
No, nothing wrong ever happens to a bus ride.

Bill Schnell
12-08-2008, 10:58 PM
Thanks Adam! If you do come through you'll get to see some of your animatronics and hear some of your sound! lol

drfrightner
12-09-2008, 12:49 AM
Bill,

Are you guys doing this or not did you make up your mind? Let us know.

Larry

JamBam
12-09-2008, 06:56 AM
Jim,
Again, don't get me wrong, that trip is very memorable. Lots of fun that night, and now looking back, it was aggravating at the time as to the slow trip there. You guys did keep us entertained with videos and interviews.

Oh, and those cookies you gave away. After we got back on the bus and we all realized you were the host and also the cookie giver, we all asked each other, "did you eat the cookies?" (erie music at this point!) lol

I-70 Gateway Haunt Tour here we come.

Jim Warfield
12-09-2008, 07:14 AM
I guess I assumed everyone knew who I was? ("Smalltownstupid!")
So would you have eaten any of those cookies if I was wearing a name tag and you had not assumed I was just a bus rider like the rest of you, but that I actually knew where the bus was going!!! (Even if I could not convince the driver)
That poor busdriver just seemed to "lose-it" once he left the city surroundings and was plowing through a sea of unending corn. (Of course there was no corn it was March, that's it! He was distracted worrying about where the corn was hiding!
Nobody likes to be startled by millions of ears of corn suddenly burying your bus!
"Where that corn! where that corn?"

JamBam
12-09-2008, 08:49 AM
Hmm, that is the question, Jim!!!!!!!

brad
12-09-2008, 11:30 AM
I just now saw this thread going.

I just wanted to jump in and say that I will go on this tour if it happened, and that I would prefer to drive myself and friends to the event.

drfrightner
12-09-2008, 03:06 PM
Some final thoughts here... one DO NOT let people drive themselves. Yes maybe a few could get there on time, not get lost, and keep on your very tight schedule but several will not. On something like this you must control 110% the schedule because you'll be on a very tight one...

Allowing people to drive is just asking for pure chaos and for sure constant gripes later. I think 90 plus percent of people who would choose to do a tour would prefer a bus and the entire trip be organized for them, pay one price and you do the rest. Its just a bad bad idea not to do this by bus only.

I think most if not all the past tours have been a totally controlled situation, especially when traveling this far.

Lastly, Transworld caught wind of this situation, and they want to know. This show has been promoted for a long time now and well if you are going to do something you should decide quickly.

Time is running out, however I will say on the other hand you should think this through very carefully and not make a move you may regret later. These things must be thought through top to bottom before pulling the trigger.

I'm sure it will take a little bit of time to figure out the busses.

If you choose to do the tour the new HHA (HauntedHouseAssociation) and (Hauntworld) would be happy to promote your tour.

Larry

brad
12-09-2008, 03:44 PM
Allowing people to drive is just asking for pure chaos and for sure constant gripes later. I think 90 plus percent of people who would choose to do a tour would prefer a bus and the entire trip be organized for them, pay one price and you do the rest. Its just a bad bad idea not to do this by bus only.

I think most if not all the past tours have been a totally controlled situation, especially when traveling this far.




If I remember correectly, when Dreamreapers was open during TW, they would have busses going back and forth, plus they allowed people to drive up themselves... I guess as long as those people proved that they were in the industry. The few times I went there, things seemed like they ran smoothly.


And in all honesty, just like Adam said... theres enough tech stuff out there, that anyone that wanted to drive themselves should be able to find it.

I really dont see a huge problem in this, but I havent ever put on an event like this myself.

SomeThingInTheIce
12-09-2008, 05:29 PM
We'll go, I don't care about the bus, we'll drive. If you charge a few more bucks for the bus trip we'll pay it but I'm going to drive I don't like the idea of being at the whims of a bus driver.

Bill Schnell
12-09-2008, 06:54 PM
Right now Greg and I agree that we would LIKE to do this tour. We are definitely not 100% sure that we WILL do the tour. We are actively checking into the details right now and seeing if we can get things arranged for the tour to happen. As soon as we are sure one way or the other we will let everyone know. I realize that we need to decide for sure soon, but I don't want to do this unless it is done right. Thanks.

drfrightner
12-09-2008, 08:27 PM
Brad,

The difference with Dreamreapers is that they are not that far away, and they where open the entire night. These guys are over two hours away, that is two hours there and over two hours back. That means you have a very TIGHT window to open and get everyone through and back to their hotels.

It has to be bus only.

Larr

N2SPOOKINU
12-09-2008, 08:33 PM
As Bill stated we are working out the final details to make sure we have everything organized and ready to go before we say yes. I know many of you want to drive and I understand. Bill and I will discuss the options. Personally I dont have a problem with people driving to our haunts. Fearfest is very easy to find we are just off hwy 70. Necropolis is a little harder to find but it's just a few exits up from us. We will let everyone know asap so things can get moving. thanks Greg

Haunted Illinois
12-09-2008, 09:11 PM
There is nothing wrong with letting people drive to the haunts themselves. We’re all grown-ups, after all. I’m driving all the way from the Rockford area to St. Louis for the show (5 hours) and I can guarantee that I won’t get lost. Traveling two hours to haunts will be a snap, in comparison. Especially considering I've got it all mapped out. LOL.

As I said before, people can map these events on many available mapping programs. I have already done so and now I have both haunts programmed into my GPS unit.

I agree with SomeThingInTheIce, who made a really good point. Part of the reason I like to drive to these events myself is that I like to live by my own schedule. If I want to stay, I can stay. If I want to leave, I can leave. It can be such a pain in the butt to have to sit around and wait for the next bus to arrive. If indeed it does arrive on time. Need I mention (again) the TW Vegas busses getting lost? LOL.

Thanks, Greg, for at least considering the idea of giving patrons the option of driving there themselves. I really appreciate it and I’m sure others do to (based on the messages in this thread).

Murphy
12-09-2008, 09:25 PM
"Transworld caught wind of this situation, and they want to know"????? Larry, what exactly does this mean? This does not have to have anything to do with Transworld, does it?

drfrightner
12-09-2008, 10:43 PM
They read the posts here, and people emailed them. They want to know if other functions are going to happen. The are at the center of this whole thing...wouldn't you agree? There are other events planned for Friday, but in America people can do whatever they want. As I stated I'm more than willing to lend all my support to them, I just think they should really think this through.

Larry

Speculo
12-10-2008, 07:20 AM
The haunts involved need to work the numbers. If BOTH will open this is can be done. Two haunts make it more compelling to drive 2 hours.

They need to decide - is it worth it to open for 50 people? Obviously many more might attend. But that is roughly one bus full.

If they are not doing renovations, and they are not paying tons of actors and they want to host haunters this might work.

If they charge $20 for the haunt and get 50 people thats $1000.

Can you open on $1000?

Of course they can charge more or less and more or less folks can come.

Would you haunters who want to visit pay $20 per haunt ($40) plus bus fare or gas/car rental to do this?


It could be on the cheap without actors of course... Then opening isn't as big of a deal. But you still need to fix broken stuff, clear the halls, fill water gags, get foggers back on line, get your key staff lined up for tours etc.

Actors ALONE It would cost me OVER $3000 to open these days -

I can never say this enough - RESPECT the Haunter that opens a show off season! Thank you guys and Larry and EVERYONE that has ever opened a haunt off season for haunters!


We all await details in the coming days...


Thanks!

Ben
NETHERWORLD

Jim Warfield
12-10-2008, 07:31 AM
"Fill the water gag"...if is not going to freeze and break.
Clear any outdoor walkways ..unless they are buried under two foot of ice and snow....emergency exits snowed in too?
Off-season can be alot of work because you're operating in the wrong season.
I have done tons of plain old work here over the years maintaining those items during bad weather. (Being open year-round)
Pnuematics, air lines and compressors sometimes "complain" too.
Nothing is "Free"!

drfrightner
12-10-2008, 11:40 AM
Well said Ben... I talked to these guys and I told them I didn't think it was worth it because they are late in the game and because I didn't know if they fully understood they could be opening and losing money. The one thing I would stress is NOT to listen to everyone who thinks you should do this for basically nothing. Charge enough so you don't lose any money, don't lose a dime on this deal.

You don't want to open for the industry, then be blasted for something, then turn out you didn't realize this or that and whamo you lost several thousand dollars.

That would suck! It will cost a lot of money to open and organize this tour and it will ruin your Transworld for sure. I still say I wouldn't do it, but if they do I'll be more than willing to help them on every level!

Larry

N2SPOOKINU
12-10-2008, 08:20 PM
Bill and I understand everyone is waiting for our decision. There is alot more at stake here than just opening up our haunts. If that were the case we would already have told you ok. Transworld is promoting the big party on Friday nite. We need to know they support our tour because if they dont then whats the use of opening up? If we do a tour on Friday nite what percentage of you guys would rather go to our tour than the party and is it going to piss Transworld off? Another issue that brought this whole thing up in the first place is Larry said he didnt think he would have enough time to get the Darkness up and ready for the convention. If this is true and it wont be open on Saturday nite WE need to know so we can change our tour nite to Saturday so it wont conflict with the party or Transworld. As far as us getting things set up on our end I have already reserved the busses and they are holding them until further notice. We have started making plans for the tour, we just need to know if we have the support of Transworld because afterall, it is their show! Thanks, Greg

Speculo
12-10-2008, 09:39 PM
Greg email me directly and I will get you in touch with Transworld.

Thanks!

speculo@comcast.net

drfrightner
12-10-2008, 09:56 PM
Gregg,

The party is NOT a Transworld party, its an IAHA party. Typically no more than 50 to 100 people attend that so I wouldn't worry about that. Secondly HHA is also planning their first ever meeting on Friday night. We will hold the meeting DIRECTLY after the show. It shouldn't last more than one hour.

As I told Bill we should get these two events HHA and your tour on the same page because this HHA meeting is VITAL to the industry. You could load up your busses directly after our meeting.

As for Saturday night as I've already stated my plan is to open, I just have to get further along before I can start selling tickets. I need to know 110% what I can or can't do... IE I don't know if my new building will be done as an example.

Blah, blah, blah... we are willing to help you on every level! The next magazine is going to press soon so you should decide quickly.

But if you going to choose a night I'd go with Friday for sure! The NEW HHA WILL BACK YOU 110%, Hauntworld Magazine will back you 110%, Hauntworld.com will back you 110%, and I personally will back your event 110%. It is your choice! If you go for it lets get this on the agenda!

Larry

The Ghoulish Gallery
12-11-2008, 03:32 AM
I thought I'd chime in here to help clarify a few things. First, the International Association of Haunted Attractions (IAHA) Dinner and Awards Banquet IS on Friday night and Transworld IS sponsoring the event, meaning they are making a considerable financial contribution to this event in order to show their support for IAHA. I have no idea if that makes this Transworld's party or not but they obviously have invested in and want to see this event be a big success.

By the way, for those not familiar, this dinner/awards program is for haunters and vendors and the awards are based on recognition of individual effort in the haunt industry, not who is first, second, third best in the industry, etc.

Additionally, Creative Visions and I believe the Halloween and Haunt Vendors Association is putting together what looks to be one Hell of an open house/party at Creative Visions studio which, in my personal opinion, should be pretty damn cool. This event will immediately follow the IAHA event.

Final details on all this are still being worked out and will be announced soon, but for now, just know this many different groups from the haunt industry are working together to create one Hell of a party that you won't want to miss. Hope to see you all there.

As for the haunt tour, I tend to agree with Larry that this is happening so late in the game that it may not be worth the effort. In any event, I've talked to Jen at Transworld about all this and hopefully we can all work together to come up with a solution that allows for a haunt tour without stepping on any of the other events that have already been planned. If not, there's always next year.

Bill, Gregg, as promised I will get back to you soon on all this.


Sincerely,

Tim Turner
Member, 2009 Transworld National Haunt and Attraction Show Advisory Board

JamBam
12-11-2008, 07:26 AM
Whoever is setting the HHA meeting up needs to remember that there are many of us that are members of BOTH groups. I am planning on attending both meetings. Also, last years event was not attended by some that have put a number on it, but the IAHA event WAS attended by Mr Morris and about 150 others including myself.

Remember, two groups CAN function and co-exist. The consequence of running IAHA out of existance will be to get those involved in that group to join HHA. Be careful what you wish for.

Lastly, if Saturday is scheduled and Darkness does open (which is what we are hoping for), a I-70 Gateway State Haunt Tour in Columbia could still happen. Those that want to attend both, could buy the timed tickets from Darkness for an early or late time.

Speculo
12-11-2008, 07:56 AM
Hopefully the plan will be to have a quick introductory HHA meeting on Friday to roll it all out to the industry.

This will take place immediately after the show closes, maybe 6-7 or even 6-6:45 on site, so as not to be in the way of other activities.

This will allow for those who choose to go to the IAHA event to do so, and those who chose to go to Haunt tour to do so.

And for that matter...those who choose to go to the bar to do so!

I agree this new group can co-exist with IAHA, and the HHVA.

This is the basic idea -

HHVA represents Vendors
HHA represents Haunted Houses
IAHA serves everyone

The thinking is that HHA will have a very clear set of goals and focus on them making success and progress very realistic.

Honestly the goal is advance this industry and help us all!

Thanks!

drfrightner
12-11-2008, 04:09 PM
Brett,

I don't agree that two haunt tours can happen on the same night especially when one of those haunts is over 2 hours away We will not open until 7pm then you have to go through the haunted house itself, and we will only allow for a certain amount of people per hour. When people go in until when they come out will be scattered... no time to go to Darkness, then drive over to some pick up spot for a bus then drive them to Columbia, blah, blah.

That is impossible. The only night for this tour is Friday. If they do it on Sunday no one will come because everyone will be going home. You can't do it on Thursday because no enough haunt will be in town yet.

Friday is the only night. So what if events like IAHA, and this haunt tour overlap, people can choose what they want to do. You yourself said it best... they only had 100 to 150 people attend. That isn't very many considering there was over 8,000 people who attended last years Transworld show.

People who want to attend IAHA can, those who don't can go to a haunt tour, those who want to do nothing but go to bed, or go eat, have meetings with customers, or just hang out in a hotel and chat with other people can do that as well. People will do what they want to do we all know that.

Just my opinion.

Larry

SomeThingInTheIce
12-11-2008, 04:58 PM
Ya, two on the same night is pushing it. I don't know my way around St. lLouis I would like to have some time to get to both events and it would be nice to have something to do on diffrent nights with other haunters.

swampboy
12-11-2008, 07:08 PM
Brett,

I don't agree that two haunt tours can happen on the same night especially when one of those haunts is over 2 hours away We will not open until 7pm then you have to go through the haunted house itself, and we will only allow for a certain amount of people per hour. When people go in until when they come out will be scattered... no time to go to Darkness, then drive over to some pick up spot for a bus then drive them to Columbia, blah, blah.

That is impossible. The only night for this tour is Friday. If they do it on Sunday no one will come because everyone will be going home. You can't do it on Thursday because no enough haunt will be in town yet.

Friday is the only night. So what if events like IAHA, and this haunt tour overlap, people can choose what they want to do. You yourself said it best... they only had 100 to 150 people attend. That isn't very many considering there was over 8,000 people who attended last years Transworld show.

People who want to attend IAHA can, those who don't can go to a haunt tour, those who want to do nothing but go to bed, or go eat, have meetings with customers, or just hang out in a hotel and chat with other people can do that as well. People will do what they want to do we all know that.

Just my opinion.

Larry

Maybe The Darkness should be Friday night then and the other Haunts Saturday Night. Its timed ticketing and very close to the event so the conflict with IAHA would be very minimal - little travel time combined with timed ticketing means a much smaller amount of people would be conflicted. Once they see the darkness they can go to the party afterwards and/or before.

Since the other haunt is 2 hours away, seems like Saturday night would be better for that one.

Seems like the best case for everyone.

JamBam
12-12-2008, 08:15 AM
The Darkness on Friday is a solution. The schedules should be coordinated somewaht as NOT to try to conflict.

Last year, the auction of that haunt was changed after the auctioneer heard rumors of ??? Maybe TW should do all scheduling.

damon carson
12-12-2008, 11:09 AM
Nothing against the other two haunts in Columbia but the Darkness shouldnt have to change any dates. Friday is there best bet if not then, well not at all. I cant really see enough people going two hours to make it worth while for anyone. Maybe there not in it for the money? I dont really care. Just how I feel hope no one takes any offense. Darkness had there dates set many months ago. There still isnt anything set in stone yet for any other tours.
Damon

xxxdirk
12-12-2008, 11:12 AM
LOL, yeah I can see Larry changing his date. No, I have to agree, Larry had this set up long before and so he should have "dibbs" on the date he picked....

drfrightner
12-12-2008, 01:10 PM
Here is how it will probably break down if these guys do their tour...

Friday Night directly after the show: First HHA meeting, directly after board buses for this haunt tour.

Clearly you have another option you can skip the haunt tour and go to the IAHA meeting. People have choices in life, to get married, to have kids, not to have kids, watch football or cut the grass, and the list goes on.

This isn't something to argue about, you as someone who will attend this show have choices you just make one and go for it.

You will also have a choice of joining the new HHA, or not joining. I think when you see the whole plan layed out, and you will see this soon that going to another IAHA meeting will be a mute point. But again choose for yourself what you want to do it is totally up to YOU!

I know what I will do... I will attend the first ever HHA meeting then board a bus for Columbia.

Larry

swampboy
12-12-2008, 07:19 PM
I'm new to the community on here so can some one tell me if the disdain for IAHA is universal? It's getting totally disrespected on here. I'm not a member btw so I don't really get offended, just surprised I guess.

xxxdirk
12-12-2008, 08:52 PM
HHA is Larry baby. Hauntworld is his board. You do the math....

drfrightner
12-13-2008, 12:10 AM
Dirk,

HHA is something this industry needs, and that includes YOU! You need a professional association speaking for YOUR industry, not home haunters, not horror fans, not enthusiasts, no one but people who own and operate haunted houses and or Halloween events.

This industry is now a 1 billion dollar industry, its high time we had our voices heard, by people who own attractions! You own an attraction and you are needed and you are valuable. Would you ever let your actors tell you how to run your business or this industry?

No you would not. Their advice can be valuable and in some cases more valuable than our own, but we are the ones taking the risks, we are the ones that deal with an injury or rain, or those failed seasons, or some new haunt that opens up down the street, or has to pay the bills in the end or answers to an irate customers, just us the owners and the operators.

I hope IAHA continues believe it or not, I hope they survive, I hope they become more of a group for everyone as Ben has stated, a group that is for all haunters, and let HHA simply be the group that speaks for the professionals. Let HHA launch efforts to promote our industry, our solve our industries problems, not home haunters, not people who do not own haunts but still somehow make their ways to these boards of IAHA.

HHA is something I know we need, just like I knew we needed national PR, just like I knew we needed to produce a television show that showcased our whole industry, and this vision is shared by many.

Once this officially launches it will not be my baby, it will be YOUR baby, you and everyone else who owns a haunted house. I will simply be ONE VOTE out of hopefully a THOUSAND!

Larry

RJ Productions
12-13-2008, 05:00 AM
I was checking the boards just after tear down and it was pretty slow, everyone recuperating. Then I take a week or so off to catch up on "real house" projects and stuff actually happens!

I like the idea of additional tours being available. Dreamreapers was successful even though other tours happened every year. They even did OK when the Frozen Tundra Tour carted people a heck of a lot further that this proposed Columbia Tour!!

I agree that having TWO separate Haunts does make the distance more bearable.

As far as opposing activities, face it you can't please everyone! The BIG issue to remember is that the IAHA party is primarily for IAHA MEMBERS. And not even all of the IAHA members will even attend. So why do these Haunt owners who are stupid enough....UH... I mean gracious enough to open their haunts have to schedule around the IAHA? People we're only talking about 150 members max....what about the OTHER hundreds of attendees??? Are they just supposed to sit around the bar and wait for the IAHA party to end??? Letís be serious. NO event pulls in every attendee, even the Darkness Tour. People that want to attend the IAHA can do so, those that want to do the tour can do so, the rest of the cheap skates will just hang around the bar and wait for people to get done and show up!!!!

My only advice to the Haunt owners is to know what you are getting yourself into. The Haunters will be the WORST audience you will ever have, PERIOD! They donít get scared, they walk 10 times slower than a normal patron, they touch what theyíre not supposed to, go where theyíre not supposed to, do what theyíre not supposed to, then do nothing but complain about it afterwards!!!!

OK Iím not being TOTALLY fair. Many of the people will truly enjoy themselves and appreciate your effort. Itís just a select few that will bitch no matter what happens and every little incident will be blown out of proportion. Just look at Adamís comment about the Vegas Tour. He makes it sound like all the busses were lost and people wandered Vegas for days!!! Actually ONE bus got lost because the driver didnít follow the map provided but used her own. Meanwhile 7 other busses each made several trips without incident, moving over 700 people with TW only allowing TWO spaces to load the busses!

I would suggest doing what the Tundra Tour did. Figure a bottom line, how many people you need to cover your basic cost. Pre-sell the tickets. If you donít get enough people by set cut off date, you cancel the tour! Possibly get one of the on-line ticket services to sponsor you. IF the tour doesnít happen everyone gets their money backÖsimple! We used Click N Print and they were great. Contact Clint and see if they would be interested, or maybe another service will set up. Just make sure they understand the cancellation policy.

If you do not have much set up, it is NOT too late to plan such a tour. Since you have two haunts working together, you can divvy up responsibility.

Larry will put on one heck of a tour, because itís Larry and he never does anything small. Will there be someone complaining? You betcha!! So I would advise the Haunt owners to do your best, but prepare for 10 times more criticism than you have ALL October, and you will be lucky to cover your expenses! The only saving grace is that most of the complaints will come from people who donít even own a haunt. The real Haunt Owners will appreciate the effort and support you as best we can.

Itís all about choices. You can never please everyone and you shouldnít expect to. TW is not stupid, they will support your tour if you go about it professionally and provide a service for the attendees. Whether they sponsor the IAHA event or not, their duty is to the entire show and the IAHA event is just a small amount of the total attendees. Itís all about choice, heck even TW schedules seminars against each other and attending the convention floor! Those that want to visit another Haunt will do so, those that donít wonít. Your biggest stumbling block will be the transportation time and thatís one thing you canít get around!

Only do this if it makes sense for you. Good luck!

drfrightner
12-16-2008, 03:00 AM
Rich,

I'm glad you are back in the fold to offer your logical advice! I love how you tell it the way it is... and you are 110% correct on this. People have choices as I've pointed out myself. People choose to watch the Super Bowl and others say 'hey this is a great day to go shopping'. Just because the Super Bowl is on TV doesn't mean all the other stations JUST SHUT DOWN!

I will attend the haunted house tour because as a haunted house owner I want to see other haunted houses. I think most people who come to this show will want to visit with vendors, write orders, grab as many idea's as possible from seminars and see haunted houses. This is our nature!

I look forward to this haunt tour. But as I've said before people have choices and they can make any choice they want...

I hope people attend the first ever HHA meeting on Friday directly after the show ends and then attends these haunted houses. For those who choose to attend other functions good for you!

Larry