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Thread: Credit Cards?

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  1. Default  
    #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    Tyler, Texas, United States
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    There are all kinds of scenarios.

    There is the need money now to take over an existing business with known amount of income that you have to buy some assets to take over, former owners ran it into the ground and bought new cars and houses instead of paying taxes on employees for 5 years.

    There is the every year get $150,000 in private investor credit, pay a few people salaries all year long for super detailed build up every year paying back that money to investors and paying back a rather high percentage. Doing that every year and every year never actually producing enough to get out from under that investor platform. In the end, someone loses eventually, investors pull out, some factor like the location gets sold out from under them and can not be replaced over night or the core staff all proves to have been deviant somehow.

    There is the type of business that pays $150,000 fully on advertising every year, reguardless of whether that is efficient or not it sounds really good like you are doing something successful.

    There are the old timers that maintain never to start a business unless you have $150,000 in cash and never before because you will never get out from under credit or the credit game will change its rules over time and you didn't count on that so you lose out and have to come up with $150,000 in cash anyhow at some point and basically take over your own company if there is a possible second wind available.

    There is the kind of business where the owner was such a go getter they had a heart attack and have $150,000 in doctor bills and only have use of half of their body and brain functioning and show up Thursday night at the Barbeque shack to share heart surgery stories.


    There are the stories on Yahoo finance where America kind of all became big box stores and some old guy needs $150,000 because he spent all his retirement, sold two homes and got an equity loan on a third home to start a hardware store in an era when there are Home Depots and Lowes big box stores because it was his dream to have an old timey hardware store, now it is a sad story and how long will it take before Bill and his wife move in with their kids and sit around all depressed and shit because they thought it just took money to make money.


    And then there is the build a business from the ground up, paying as you go that actually makes a meager profit that you can actually walk away from with cash in you pocket if a location or whole community doesn't work out for you. That can be done over and over where like in the days when there was nothing 100 years ago, you can drop that man in any town with maybe $1000 and in a year walk out with the next years full income.


    Or there are the types of businesses where there are industry magazines and business plan demos you can possibly duplicate and reports of thousands of these types of businesses that all certainly must be doing so well and you can too if you just weasel your entire family for the fortune and credit they have amassed and it will all be grand somehow when you become part of the machine. Just do what someone in California has done in some backward little town in the wonderful world of America where you have the right to lose and go back and get a job and file for bankruptsy. So the question is, if you do lose, who wins? Well, 95% of start ups don't go past year 2 because no one really taught finance properly, not even the most supposedly advanced colleges in the country. SO don't lose, don't play the game. Don't have to be all 24/7 assholes and elbows because you were told by some 20 year old magazine writer that never actually did anything in their life that the facts are in.

    So to truely be successful, you develop your own market, you don't buy one. You pay as you go, you don't over extend on credit especially in a situation where you might get hit with $40,000 in zoning issues and compliance problem half an hour before opening your business. You go in much smaller cycles that are proven to be successful to only your own yearly balance sheet. You can be super resourcefull and go years and years making money and really have only spent $10,000 where you might question if that was a necessary expense or you can go spend $150,000 and give a seminar and no one will really no what a dumbass you are because they haven't done that or probably won't get ahold of that much money but, it sounds good. If only I could get a shit load of money, what would I do with it, it would be great.

    The key is the money comes from ticket buying customers whether it starts out at $2 a ticket or $20 a ticket, it doesn't come from Grandmas food stamps savings, some asshole loan officer that you agreed to hire his kid, Some fat assed investor group that wants 40% on the dollar every year and certainly thinks you should come on the yearly cruise too.

    Where does all this money go? How fat are all these people? Do they really work or do they only really work their jaws? Sure you can get fronted $50,000 and all the ticket money goes to paying off that $50,000 plus a factor of times 1.5, then you have to run around pretending to be a go getter too until that money is satisified. Then if you haven't already killed your health, your family, your credit, your sanity you can do it again for yourself on the third cycle and it will be great!

    Haunts are a seasonal business and I watch the big earners get behind different ways of marketing that costs lots of money and then 2 years later they will say that didn't work and isn't really what the business was about at it's core. And over and over and over I hear something like a billboard cost $30,000 or a bunch of props cost $30,000 or a machine that makes props and all the supplies cost $30,000 and it is the best thing they ever did in their life but all the actors and artists at a haunt all did everything for no pay at all and $30,000 could have been payroll for everyone! Why wasn't it? Who pays? Who loses? Is it a real business? It can be if the priorities are right.

    Money comes from the customers. Then it pays everyone involved for real work performed and maybe there is some left over. Maybe there isn't some left over. If it was done on credit, it becomes a somebody somewhere loses somewhere scenario because that is the American way. Kind of an everyone that has never done this before sharing little secrets and rumors of how they think someone else actually makes lots of money when who they are talking about was just a blow hard that won't even admit to themselves they ripped everyone else off in their lives and it is all fronted on credit that could implode any day.

    The right way is to pay cash for some tool. Either the sears craftman $139 home handy man set or the $13,000 I got a bunch of walls lets put on a show because it's a recession and I'm otherwise unemployable starter kit and go to work. There are tons of scenarios where people inherited money and spent it all regardless of how efficiently and got all this stuff you will never be able to afford. Or 5 people all got together and had money and it always seems 3 or 4 of them screwed away a decade of their life and will never get over that lesson.

    You see all the pictures of the 20,000 SF haunts built just the way they wanted. All the fancy things. Is that really what the customer wanted? Isn't it some kind of odd spectacle like going to a monster truck show, makes no sense what so ever but people line up and go see it trying to figure it out? Or is it something the community really becomes a fan of and goes to every year because there might be nothing but some black walls and dummies and 5 guys with masks running around but it is real, it isn't like TV.

    Then there is the reality not seen in any magazine where you drive around and just read the signs. They say air conditioning and taxedermy. Transmission specialist and Gunsmith. Arts and crafts and siding supply. Hardware and auto parts. Day care and limosine service. Or even in the haunt deal, people have a haunt but they also act at 2 others, make props for 5 haunts, sell stuff at 3 trade shows and work 6 other kinds of festivals and carnivals just to make a living. Still after taxes just a living.

    Most succesful businesses discover down the road a few years that 80 percent of their customers are the biggest pain in the ass ever, expect the most and want to pay the least. There is 20% that alone actually support the business and buy in volumes and don't haggle for prices, they value their time and your time and things happen. So what if right off the bat you could figure out how to lower all the stress in your life and know your own pattern will work and you only cater to that 20% of good customers right off the bat, how sweet would that be?

    Well, conversely you can get rid of 80% of the predatory lenders, the telemarketers and phone book solicitors, the false insurance over writers that need all in cash up front and pay a bigger company by the month and loan out your money, the banks and fees they like to come up with, the delays from all the crap in consumer society, the advertising staffs sitting around waiting to take your $4,000 call. Lets get rid of all the investors that want to talk about their health 3 times a week on the phone until 3AM because you might be their only freind that understands. Lets get rid of the assholes that think they pimped you out and really hooked you up somehow and now you owe them. Lets get rid of all the losers that need a cigarette from you and $30 a day and can you give them a ride to the probation office at noon today. Lets get rid of 80% of all the bullshit that really holds you back from day one.

    The solution is in the next post.


    Another fabulous post from the U.S.Department of Wild Imaginings, now in spectaclar stereo, sponsored by the Adhesives and Sealants Council, suggesting ways to stick things together since the 1800s. Not fabulous in a gay way. Your results may vary. Illinois residents add 8% sales tax. These posts have been made by professional post makers, do not try this type of posting on your own without extensive training, lovely assistants and a trusty clown horn.
     

  2. Default  
    #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Tyler, Texas, United States
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    2,614
    Being a credit card millionare worked great in 1980. You could buy a house on a cash advance and have a few other credit cards to pay those credit cards and sell the house for a profit and you didn't even have to speak the language. That was before computers hooked up all the banks in a federal system. You can become a super weasel and figure out what banks subscribe to what federal systems, which ones report and with ones don't. Intest on a credit card is nothing if you can pay it before the 30 days bill so that really means in 3 weeks given how wicked fast the post office is.

    Except now, every purchase, the amount and the type of purchase and to the day when payments are recieved are a ticking time bomb of screwing up your credit. Back when everyone was supposed to have credit it was only 4% APR and now it is if you are an hour late you pay 31% from then on because you are the loser. And you will lose. Why not just go to the dollar store and give them twice the money for that box of twinkies. That is what you are doing especially if you take years to pay off your balance.

    I joke about what I had to pay for my current business that is doing well but it really isn't a joke. I found a guy that was doing it wrong, I worked for him and we earned all the equipment it needed instead of im renting. Then I worked hard to buy the equipment from him when I bought the business. Then I worked hard again and bought all the equipment from al the contractors I worked for so they couldn't just go do a job with out buyig new equipment, then I worked harder even still and rebuilt all this junk equipment and then I worked even harder to wear out 3 sets of equipment over the course of 15 years until there was only one set of equipment left. And then the market changed where you really didn't need all of this equipment, only some of it. Yet, every fe years some new person goes out and taks grandmas money and buys all new equipment and fancy trucks with signs on them and lasts about a year before they figure out they don't have any customers that are not that 80% I already dumped because they were all about them and psycotic.

    SO at what point in the market are you jumping into? Are you creating a market or taking over one where someone else failed or one where someone left only the dregs? Or will someone see all of your fancy spending as something they might want to do too and take that 20% of good customers because customers really have no loyalty at all until they have been burned by everyone else.

    Another fun thing is having a hobby mentality. You buy $1000 worth of the latest mask making products, $1000 worth of carpentry tools, $1000 worth of airbrushing equipment, buy a couple $2500 props just to see how they are made and maybe you can make your own after that, lets get crazy and figure out how $5,000 worth of sound equipment works, lets try the new style of lighting for $4,000, lets get a couple $3,000 costumes, that will make sure people think we are for real, lets buy a couple props from someone that this is their first year building such things and it's okay if we ar guinee pigs as customers, we love making phone calls and bitching on the internet. We are gonna need a cre cab dooley with a vehicle wrap and a hearse and iphones for everyone and lap tops and GPS systems and all kinds of shit. We are gonna need some of those $470 masks and the $270 costumes that go with them.

    You know spending money is a lot of work. And then all that shit you bought seems to break down, needs replaced, repaired maintained and stored and prevented from theft and insured and moved all over the place and all along all you needed was a drill with a screw bit in it from a garage sale. They sell paint brushes at the paint store. They sell spray bottles at the dollar store. Allen Hopps videos tell you how to make all this shit for $4 in 15 minutes. You have Jim Warfield right here totally for free on the Interwebs with 12,000 posts basically telling you it is about stimulating the customers minds and senses, not about puzzling them with something that cost $150,000.

    Then you have me that wonders how some serious retards have made it through life and got so many other people to pay for every aspect of their lives because you have to help them reach that goal in their lives if at all possible. Doesn't matter if they are functionally illiterate or stupid or have no skills what so ever, they have to have a trophy. And if they make $20 they are done for the day and off in the car to Dairy Queen and even if they are 60 and run into not being able to pay the bills, momma will give them some money. And if you do a job for them that makes them some money they are in the car going on a 3 day vacation and didn't pay you your part first. Or you drive into some place to get your check and there is no check but there is a brand new truck there. Gee where did my money go?

    Everyone needs to live their lives but it really doesn't have to be all stressful. The economy is still there, never went away, just what is for real has changed. What was real relative to money hasn't changed. The only thing talked about in the media and internet reports are the crazy things. You never hear Bob just did his same routine and made a deposit in the bank because he did some work, back to you Susan! You never hear ralph earned that money, you only hear you can steal money or borrow money or do a ponzi scheme or become a corporation backed on everyones insurance holdings and pensions they will never get. You will get an hour of how they figured out how to sell corn puffs to your stupid ass and you will watch it in between 30 commercials because you are livin the dream.

    So if being creative makes people happy, why aren't people creating things? Why do they buy all this shit and expect everyone will love it? Why do people buy things produced by a machine and think everyone else wants something made from a machine. You can make things one of a kind for $10 and be really weird instead of buying things for $100 that there are 20 of and pictures on the internet to prove it. It takes just as long to make something as it takes to go shopping. Or you spend $1000 to go to a trade show to buy something for $100. Well, I guess you are living your life and shit. Education is expensive. Or maybe it isn't? Who said it was? Someone that is being paid as an educator? Damn everything is some kind of scam, you can't win.

    Who said it takes money to make money? Someone that loans money. You can make a mud puddle scary. How much does that cost?


    Another fabulous post from the U.S.Department of Wild Imaginings, now in spectaclar stereo, sponsored by the Adhesives and Sealants Council, suggesting ways to stick things together since the 1800s. Not fabulous in a gay way. Your results may vary. Illinois residents add 8% sales tax. These posts have been made by professional post makers, do not try this type of posting on your own without extensive training, lovely assistants and a trusty clown horn.
     

  3. Default  
    #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Tyler, Texas, United States
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    So everyone go to the Raven's Grin Inn located in Illinois, open all year and buy all of Allen Hopps DVDs. Now continue with living your life.


    Another fabulous post from the U.S.Department of Wild Imaginings, now in spectaclar stereo, sponsored by the Adhesives and Sealants Council, suggesting ways to stick things together since the 1800s. Not fabulous in a gay way. Your results may vary. Illinois residents add 8% sales tax. These posts have been made by professional post makers, do not try this type of posting on your own without extensive training, lovely assistants and a trusty clown horn.
     

  4. Default  
    #14
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    Mar 2012
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    153
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Chrise View Post
    Who said it takes money to make money?
    Money isn't the cause of failure or success. It's how YOU use it that determines that... regardless of the source. But with no money... you're a hobo building your haunt out of a cardboard box in an alley. Sure you could start your business there but how long do you have to live to make it a financial success? I guess that depends on what "financial success" means to you.
     

  5. Default that Cardboard/alley haunt 
    #15
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    Ravens Grin Inn, 411 carroll st.mount carroll ill.
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    just may be "The Ticket", look at Justin Beaver, a You-tube video and he's a Richie Rich now!
    Build that cardboard haunt, pray for no rain.
    (I prefer an old chicken coop, myself.)
    We fimed a very funny, accidental video involving a chicken coop (in my back yard)
    IT was "The Love shack"! I am carrying a foxy mannequin about to enter the Love Shack when the bottom half of the dummy accidentaly falls from the upper body. I stand there stunned for a mere moment or three, then said something like:"Well I guess this WAS the half I REALLY WANTED!"
    And walk into the coop holding the upper half.
     

  6. Default  
    #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
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    613
    Quote Originally Posted by mrfoos View Post
    Money isn't the cause of failure or success. It's how YOU use it that determines that... regardless of the source. But with no money... you're a hobo building your haunt out of a cardboard box in an alley. Sure you could start your business there but how long do you have to live to make it a financial success? I guess that depends on what "financial success" means to you.
    Looking forward to Greg's response to this one. *breaking out the popcorn*
     

  7. Default "It's How you USE it!?" 
    #17
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    The problem is always having enough money to get all of those things that you are supposed to have, need, get.
    Adding up a column of numbers can be debillitating when the total key is pushed.
    IT says:"And YOU thought you had enough money!?"
    How much is ever "Enough"?
    I can't answer that question, but I know I have never come close to whatever mythical figure it may actually be or become.
    Do you spend $25,000 a season on advertising? ME? Never even close, sometimes spending nothing at all!
    Where does the ticket money go then? It stays right close to me!
    When the money is rolling "IN", it will not always keep rolling in because of numerous factors and major influences, many of which are beyond our control....
     

  8. Default  
    #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Warfield View Post
    Where does the ticket money go then? It stays right close to me! When the money is rolling "IN", it will not always keep rolling in because of numerous factors and major influences, many of which are beyond our control....
    Because if you are indeed only open a few weekends out of the year, then having 2 weekends, or even 2 nights, totally rained out can totally sink you for the next year.

    I wonder where you put that on the "business plan"? Perhaps right next to the column where it said you maxed out your credit cards and mortgaged out your home on your haunt in your first year.

    C.
    Last edited by BrotherMysterio; 06-29-2012 at 11:18 PM.
     

  9. Default  
    #19
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    The real super successful people that have haunts and routine numbers of customers and routine amounts of money to deal with. The ones that last decades not just a few years, typically started out with nothing what so over. Real honest to god hobos or outcasts. They ended up having a different perspective of what it took to make that money, where the guy who thinks the world is the guy with the most collateral when he dies wins doesn't live real long or have a healthy life from all the stress. The people that know there is a new cardboard box being thrown out somewhere in the world tend to go all out to exactly not have to pick out that next box. The credit or other peoples money guy thinks you hire someone to do all that and it magically happens.

    Another bunch that says it takes money to make money are financial advisers and now the whole country is finding out if you give your money to someone else, guess what, you gave your money to someone else. You think it is making money but it isn't your money anymore, you will never see your money back. Or when you do get it back it is now income that has taxes due. So that money can go to other people who don't want to work also.

    Something where you might be able to inventively take some money and turn it into money any time of the year as needed might work for the modern day credit card millionaire but something seasonal means it only happens once a year at harvest time? You better know exactly where to go and when to sell something. Preferably indoors or really quick like selling stuff out of the trunk of your car.

    You can have a nice car that is on payments or lease, you can have an iphone that costs so much a month, you can be on the road to owning your own home and property and dress real snazzy and talk all positive and still those credit cards aren't getting you a 20,000 SF haunt in an old Walmart building inspected as okay by the city. Your credit cards aren't what the city or property owners want to hear. They want to hear that some billion dollar organization is going to employ a few people and pay for a whole year in rent up front in cash.

    So yes, we are going to start out with a card board box and off season do freaking puppet shows from that same box that can be picked up and run with like the little cardboard cars on Romper Room to survive. So you are gonna flash credit cards in a cardboard box world? Kind of a mismatch. We want real coinage or tools that can be a performance art the makes more people throw more coins into the box. When everyone gets a little lax on donating we are going to a new crowd a few blocks over. Then we are forming a Hobo coop where we can trade information. We are helping other Hobos out and getting help back when we least expect it. It's a life style.

    Yes, you can use credit cards, it doesn't matter because you will end up cutting them all up anyhow if you are hanging around Hobo town. You are the new popular guy and everyone has something to sell you. You didn't earn the money from the ground up so what the hell lets party, we can always go make more. Then you can't make more. Oh oh.

    All the other Hobos laugh at you. You fell for the credit card trick? HA HA HA!

    I didn't respond earlier because he has a legitimate point. A different way of thinking. A younger man's sentiment. The younger people are supposed to over extend themselves and keep paying the older people. They eventually get old too and wise up but when they are young they already know everything and listen to catch phrases made by Ben Franklin in the years when he was crazy mad with syphilis. But it all sounds reasonable. I mean he printed it in a book so it must be real.


    Another fabulous post from the U.S.Department of Wild Imaginings, now in spectaclar stereo, sponsored by the Adhesives and Sealants Council, suggesting ways to stick things together since the 1800s. Not fabulous in a gay way. Your results may vary. Illinois residents add 8% sales tax. These posts have been made by professional post makers, do not try this type of posting on your own without extensive training, lovely assistants and a trusty clown horn.
     

  10. Default Run Forest Run! 
    #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    388
    I began working on building up a haunt some 12 years ago, collecting a few little things here and there over the years, until I had a respectful inventory of props I had either built from scrap materials or purchased real cheap. It wasnt until I reached a point where I had a decent inventory that I opened the doors of The Plague to the public.

    Everything is financed by me. I dont believe in using credit cards because the terms are lousy and I hate paying bills. If you build slow, and invest over time, you will be able to build a great attraction that is 100% paid for! By the way, Big T Productions Inc owns a diesel for hauling, 100% paid for, a utility trailer for hauling, and flat bed trailer for hauling, and several other assets that are all 100% paid for!

    If something happens and we have a bad year, I dont get my money back . It just means I get to try again the next year, and I dont have to worry about paying those bills!

    BTW - we are now able to buy from all the big guys which is really paying off because it adds a lot to the attraction, and we are adding a new attraction this year as well ....... its all about your savings plan!
    Travis "Big T" Russell
    President
    Big T Productions Inc

    Owner and Operator of "The Plague" and "Camp Nightmare"

    Customer Quote of the year: "Damn, I pissed myself"
     

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